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  • My ess hookup theory

    Wondering if this would work: I realized that most, if not all of what I want played over my whole house audio comes from my HA PC. I want it to be seperated out, though, so that they can be played concurrently in seperate zones, one zone having input A and one zone having input B.

    I currently have 3 sound cards installed on my pc. I'd like one to be dedicated to the WMP plugin. I'd like another to be dedicated to the HS TTS. I'd like the third to be dedicated to the xm radio online setup that I just got worked out from Shane.

    I wold like to add a 4th that would be "general default system" for if I play a dvd through the hapc into my theater or something. So then I would take all 4 sound card outputs and run them into various inputs on my receiver, cd, tape, etc, and then I would have the two outputs (multizone) going from my receiver to the ess.

    To me it seems like a good theory. I just have no idea how to do it with the different sound cards. I've heard of people (Jack, I think?) using multiple speaker clients running on the same PC to accomplish something like this. I'm not sure how it works though.

    Ian
    Plugins:
    BLLogMonitor, BLGarbage, BLBackup, BLOutGoingCalls, BLUps, BLRfid, JvEss, DooMotion, Applied Digital Ocelot, AC RF Processor, UltraMon, PJC AVR 430, UPB, Rain8net, DSC Panel, JRiver Media center, Windows Media Player, SageMediaCenter, SnevlCID, MCSTemperature.

  • #2
    Yes I did at one time have multiple sound cards, i'll have to think back on how I did it (been over 2 years ago) What you might want to do is find like an M-Audio Delta 1010lt (this one card has 10 outputs (and 10 inputs) (4 stereo analog pairs and a digital) I currently have one in my music server and can stream 5 different audio feeds at the same time. my current setup is not directly controlled thru HS though. I have mlserver/mainlobby/J River/musiclobby on a separate box, the 4 analog pairs feed my Nuvo system (sources 1-4) and the digital feeds my Theater, then thru the mlhsplugin I send artist, song title and album info to HS which is then in turn displayed on my betabrite. I do the same thing with my video server, sending one analog to my Nuvo and the digital to my Theater. The M-Audio cards are very versatile altho the 2 I have are a couple years old. I don't know anything about their current product line. The 1010lt has some nice software (mixer/patchbay) for setting levels and such

    I am rethinking how I can utilize the ESS functionality, because I do have TTS in more rooms than I have WHA and with the ESS I can expand my WHA
    Over The Hill
    What Hill?
    Where?
    When?
    I Don't Remember Any Hill

    Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

    Comment


    • #3
      Is HS able to assign certain audio signals to certain outputs on the Delta, though? i've heard of Jriver a few times, I think that is the only one that works w/ HS that is able to be told which audio out to use, unless the wmp plugin can (that's what I currently use).

      So do you have mono tts speakers that are ran seperately from the wha?

      I think that's the way David Kindred's system is set up. he has volume controls in wall for the wha, controlled by one ab8ss, and a seperate mono speaker ran directly to another ab8ss for tts.
      Plugins:
      BLLogMonitor, BLGarbage, BLBackup, BLOutGoingCalls, BLUps, BLRfid, JvEss, DooMotion, Applied Digital Ocelot, AC RF Processor, UltraMon, PJC AVR 430, UPB, Rain8net, DSC Panel, JRiver Media center, Windows Media Player, SageMediaCenter, SnevlCID, MCSTemperature.

      Comment


      • #4
        I know with the J River player you can assign which zone goes to which output pair on the Delta, never used wmp.

        Yes my TTS and my WHA are two completely separate beasts, most rooms have 3 speakers in the ceiling (WHA left and right and TTS in mono) The nuvo has wall mounted keypads in each room but Cinemar Mainlobby has a plugin that connects to the nuvo serial port and I have a touch screen screen for control. I can also control all aspects of the Nuvo from HS events via the mlhsplugin

        My TTS is just a single mono channel currently being distributed via 2 AB8SS's. I have TTS in 11 locations and WHA in 8 locations
        Over The Hill
        What Hill?
        Where?
        When?
        I Don't Remember Any Hill

        Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

        Comment


        • #5
          ok, revisiting this, as my ess modules should be showing up "soon" and i've been changing things around to get ready for them.

          I have 3 sound cards, 2 amps, one of which has a multizone input.

          soundcard A runs to amp A, I'm running HS Speaker to that. that will be my "dedicated speaker" channel. I'll run it's L/R speaker output to input A of ESS

          soundcard B runs to amp B's "DVD" input. This is the digital audio, default system audio. will be used for MCE movies, mp3's etc.
          soundcard C runs to amp B's multizone input.
          Amp B will have multizone output to input B of ESS, and connected to my 7.1 theater.

          I'll have JRiver Media Center w/ plugin zoning audio out to inputs A and B of the ESS. the thought being that I will only use the default audio for tv/movie watching. If I wanted to, I could use HS to control the input source on amp B multizone, providing the tv/movie to the whole house audio.

          so now I just need a way of managing it all. I'll need to figure out how to switch back and forth on A/B, for TTS. some tts is zoned, some is "global." if a certain zone of the house is listening to something on input A, I want to be able to show that input A is "occupied" and therefore when there's a "call" to listen to something else from a different zone, the system would know it needs to use "B." But then, the means tts would "toggle."

          am i making any sense? am i making it too complicated? perhaps there's an easier way (that doesn't involve running a 3rd, mono, dedicated tts speaker - Jack :-)

          Thanks,

          Ian
          Plugins:
          BLLogMonitor, BLGarbage, BLBackup, BLOutGoingCalls, BLUps, BLRfid, JvEss, DooMotion, Applied Digital Ocelot, AC RF Processor, UltraMon, PJC AVR 430, UPB, Rain8net, DSC Panel, JRiver Media center, Windows Media Player, SageMediaCenter, SnevlCID, MCSTemperature.

          Comment


          • #6
            Ian, just now saw your post, let me chew on your ideas for a bit and I'll let you know what I come up with (have had a houseful of people all weekend)

            Jack
            Over The Hill
            What Hill?
            Where?
            When?
            I Don't Remember Any Hill

            Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

            Comment


            • #7
              Cool, Jack.

              I was thinking, actually, that it may be better to make each source permanently assigned to a certain thing. so TTS would always be Amp A, input A, streaming MP3 would always be amp B, "X" input on the amp, tv would be tv input on amp B, and so on.

              seems like that would be easier to manage.
              Plugins:
              BLLogMonitor, BLGarbage, BLBackup, BLOutGoingCalls, BLUps, BLRfid, JvEss, DooMotion, Applied Digital Ocelot, AC RF Processor, UltraMon, PJC AVR 430, UPB, Rain8net, DSC Panel, JRiver Media center, Windows Media Player, SageMediaCenter, SnevlCID, MCSTemperature.

              Comment


              • #8
                You know, I am almost thinking for the greatest flexibility since the ESS only has 2 inputs and you currently have 3, but it would depend on your second receiver (is it controllable via IR?), how many spare inputs you have on your primary (7.1 receiver) and how you currently have everything hooked up. What if (by using "Y" cords) sent each of your 3 current sources to both receivers and each receiver dedicated to an ESS input. So for example your second receiver connected to the ESS input A and your 7.1 connected to ESS input B. Then each of your sources connected to both receivers, so for example your wife is in the kitchen listening to music on ESS "A" and you are listening to TV Audio in another zone, if a specific TTS message, say for you then have HS switch the ESS "B" amp to the TTS input. This would solve the "zoned TTS" problem, if it is a "global TTS" then HS could switch both amps to the TTS input. The events could get a little complex, but do-able

                Another Idea as I am typing this, you could get a matrix switcher, with say 4 or more inputs and 2 or more outputs (there are many many types/price ranges/features out there) The way a matrix switcher works is any input can be fed to any output and again it depends on which features the receivers have (tape loops/processor loops) you would never have to switch the receivers at all.

                I'll draw up a quick visio for you

                Jack
                Over The Hill
                What Hill?
                Where?
                When?
                I Don't Remember Any Hill

                Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

                Comment


                • #9
                  my second (7.1) receiver is controllable via IR and rs232. Pjc wrote a plugin to control it, cuz he has one too.

                  It has more inputs than i could ever want. It is a 7.1, with a zone II. so I can use the plugin to toggle between tape, cd, and tv. they are all R/L composite.

                  I have the optical ("toslink") connector from one of my sound cards to the DVD in on the receiver, and the other sound cards to CD, tape, and TV.

                  the clincher is: my second receiver is NOT controllable via anything except my finger. i'm not opposed to replacing it, though, with one that is IR controlled. If I am going to replace it I may be interested in a matrix switcher, like you mentioned. Do those still need to be amp'd or do they have an amp built in?

                  The tricky thing is, the tts announcements i have are set up for location, not person. the logic would need to determine which zones/amps are being used for the location, not sure how that would work.

                  maybe the switching matrix would be easier?
                  Plugins:
                  BLLogMonitor, BLGarbage, BLBackup, BLOutGoingCalls, BLUps, BLRfid, JvEss, DooMotion, Applied Digital Ocelot, AC RF Processor, UltraMon, PJC AVR 430, UPB, Rain8net, DSC Panel, JRiver Media center, Windows Media Player, SageMediaCenter, SnevlCID, MCSTemperature.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Yes, the matrix switcher would be the easiet and the most robust, but as always probably the pricey-ist, there is a 4 input 4 output that is IR controlled for around $200. Switching the concept from person to location wouldn't be that difficult. You could base it on status of each of the ESS7 modules as to which input to switch

                    and to answer your question, the matrix switcher would still require an amp, think of it as the same concept as the ESS but switching line level instead of speaker level.

                    When I designed my system, I went round and round and why I decided to just have 2 complete systems for TTS and distributed audio, and even then it is not a perfect solution, but I can live with the drawbacks

                    J
                    Over The Hill
                    What Hill?
                    Where?
                    When?
                    I Don't Remember Any Hill

                    Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      So I reread this, and I think you were describing using each receiver as a switcher to control tts to certain areas, as opposed to using the ess to switch to a tts. i looked over my original concept, and i think the weakness was if I have amp A going to ESS A as ONLY TTS that basically kills the A side for anything other than TTS, so if the B side is in use, that would be what I'm stuck with. The solution I'm thinking of is to use the JRiver media player and plugin to send streaming mp3 to the same sound card as the TTS. So it would be:

                      TTS and streaming mp3 on amp A, to ESS A
                      MCE (media center, which is dvd, tv, xmradio and mp3) to TV of amp B, to ESS B
                      other outputs from pc to other inputs to amp B

                      amp B switches, as needed.

                      So each source would still be "dedicated" but I'd have both A and B more usable, with current hardware and setup.

                      what are your thoughts?

                      Let me know how it goes when you get your ess!

                      Ian

                      Originally posted by jackpod View Post
                      You know, I am almost thinking for the greatest flexibility since the ESS only has 2 inputs and you currently have 3, but it would depend on your second receiver (is it controllable via IR?), how many spare inputs you have on your primary (7.1 receiver) and how you currently have everything hooked up. What if (by using "Y" cords) sent each of your 3 current sources to both receivers and each receiver dedicated to an ESS input. So for example your second receiver connected to the ESS input A and your 7.1 connected to ESS input B. Then each of your sources connected to both receivers, so for example your wife is in the kitchen listening to music on ESS "A" and you are listening to TV Audio in another zone, if a specific TTS message, say for you then have HS switch the ESS "B" amp to the TTS input. This would solve the "zoned TTS" problem, if it is a "global TTS" then HS could switch both amps to the TTS input. The events could get a little complex, but do-able

                      Another Idea as I am typing this, you could get a matrix switcher, with say 4 or more inputs and 2 or more outputs (there are many many types/price ranges/features out there) The way a matrix switcher works is any input can be fed to any output and again it depends on which features the receivers have (tape loops/processor loops) you would never have to switch the receivers at all.

                      I'll draw up a quick visio for you

                      Jack
                      Plugins:
                      BLLogMonitor, BLGarbage, BLBackup, BLOutGoingCalls, BLUps, BLRfid, JvEss, DooMotion, Applied Digital Ocelot, AC RF Processor, UltraMon, PJC AVR 430, UPB, Rain8net, DSC Panel, JRiver Media center, Windows Media Player, SageMediaCenter, SnevlCID, MCSTemperature.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Ian,

                        Here is a diagram using a matrix switcher. With a matrix switcher any input can go to any output (or the same input can go to any or all outputs)
                        Attached Files
                        Over The Hill
                        What Hill?
                        Where?
                        When?
                        I Don't Remember Any Hill

                        Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          So, by using the above diagram/matrix switcher you could have a J River feed going to ESS "A" and a different J River feed going to ESS "B", have HS switch the matrix switcher to TTS to either one or both ESS Zones for an announcement and then switch back again, or if your wife is listening to music in the kitchen and you are watching a game and you go into the kitchen for something to eat, you could switch the ESS from music to the game while you are eating.

                          In other words, make TTS the variable which would allow you to have your choice of two other sources in each and every location with TTS a switchable option to any or all zones when needed

                          Make sense?
                          Over The Hill
                          What Hill?
                          Where?
                          When?
                          I Don't Remember Any Hill

                          Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Most Matrix Switchers today also switch some type of video, but that feature would not be used. Here is one for just over $200 that has 4 inputs and 4 outputs
                            http://www.vpi.us/av-switch-cva.html
                            Over The Hill
                            What Hill?
                            Where?
                            When?
                            I Don't Remember Any Hill

                            Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by jackpod View Post
                              I know with the J River player you can assign which zone goes to which output pair on the Delta, never used wmp.

                              Yes my TTS and my WHA are two completely separate beasts, most rooms have 3 speakers in the ceiling (WHA left and right and TTS in mono) The nuvo has wall mounted keypads in each room but Cinemar Mainlobby has a plugin that connects to the nuvo serial port and I have a touch screen screen for control. I can also control all aspects of the Nuvo from HS events via the mlhsplugin

                              My TTS is just a single mono channel currently being distributed via 2 AB8SS's. I have TTS in 11 locations and WHA in 8 locations
                              Sorry to barge in.
                              Does MainLobby's MLMAudio plugin fit anywhere in this? It can control Delta as matrix switcher.

                              Comment

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