No announcement yet.

AP800 and PZM11 - How to connect?

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    AP800 and PZM11 - How to connect?

    Hi all,

    HA noob here, I just bought an AP800 and a few PZM11s. I have a 22 gauge, two conductor jacketed cable with an overall shield and drain wire. ( Two Conductors Plus Ground).
    I connect the red to +, the black to - and the ground wire to ground in the microphone.
    Then I connect the same to the Phoenix connector in the back of the AP800. But the mic does not work.
    How do I provide Phantom power to it? Thanks!!!

    As you look at the rear of the AP800, the right hand wire is ground, middle wire should be black and left red (that's how mine is wired, I think the black and red are interchangeable).

    The AP800 must be set to provide phantom power to the Mic (via the inputs menu).



      The phantom power can be enabled from the panel or the Gentner software. Believe me, use the software since it will give you a clear graphical view of what you are doing. The phantom power is applied to both the leads refrenced to ground.

      The matching of the two signal leads end for end between the mike and AP800 will result in a positive (outward) movement of the speaker when there is positive preasure on the microphone (like the when pronouncing the letter 'P'). This results in the output being 'in phase' with the input and results in better sound reproduction.

      I don't know for a fact, but I would bet having different mikes connected with different phasing would raise issues with VR. After all, the pattern match is based on the waveform, so having a negative version show up might cause recognition problems. As I said, I have no proof, but it makes sense.



        With regard to microphone phasing and VR.

        If one microphone is used, phase doesn't matter, as the vr engine dynamically will find the signature in the waveform, regardless if it's a half cycle out of phase.

        If more than one mic is used it gets more complicated. if only one mic per room (or the microphone pickup patterns don't overlap at all) treat it with the same logic as a single mic configuration. On the other hand, if more than one microphone picks up the same voice at any given time, weird things can happen.

        If two waveforms in phase are added together, the result is additive. the waveform will have double the amplitude. if they are out of phase, they will cancel each other out and the result will be no waveform. this is [part of] how noise cancelling headphones work.

        Remember that the electrical phasing isn't the only thing that affects phasing, but also the acoustical phase. the placement of the microphones, with respect to the source of the sound also affects the phasing. in practical terms, this only becomes problematic when two mics are too close to each other picking up the same source. Complete cancellation will result in a flat waveform (no audio). Partial cancellation can result can be an odd "hollow" sounding waveform. both of the latter will confuse the VR engine. If you've ever seen an amatuer stage play, where two performers wearing lavalier microphones come into close proximity, the sound through the speakers will sound weird or hollow.

        Most of the time, you want to wire all of your mics, with the same phase arrangement. If however when listening to the output of the mixer, you hear that cancellation effect, it can be helpful to wire one of the two offending mics out of phase to correct the problem.

        Probably more info than you wanted, but it's late and I'm bored.

        Happy wiring


          I have 2 of these, and an AP800, i am having trouble getting anything other than a small click from the mic when i tap it. The signal is tiny, and certainly not enough for vr. I have enabled phantom power, but what is this "drain" wire i see people mentioning please?


            what version of the PZM-11 do you have? hopefully it's not the PZM11LL or PZM11S2

            These AP800 units are designed to be used with professional microphones having a 3 wire balanced connection. This wiring would have a single twisted pair with a shield. the drain wire is a wire that is electrically part of the cable's shield. you'll commonly see a foil shield with a bare wire running along it. This is the drain wire. The right kind of wire is important for microphones. Cat5 is not appropriate. The standard convention for wiring mics is Red to audio+, Black to audio-, and shield/drain to signal gnd.

            While there are many wire manufacturers, with several variants, I always specify Gepco 61801EZ for installed mic lines.
            While gepco is my favorite because they're local, and the wire is particularly easy to work with, Belden and West Penn are probably the most commonly found wire.

            Belden's part would be 9451.
            West Penn would be 454

            All condenser mics require power to function. Most use phantom power on the mic line to accomplish this. others may need local power. A condenser mic is usually a small capsule and will have an active electronic module somewhere near the mic. (on the board on the plate for the PZM11) this module may be in the mic assembly itself, or in a "line lump" in the mic's cable or gooseneck or something similar. this electronic module is powered by the phantom power on the mic line, and acts as a preamp and balancing module. it takes the unbalanced line from the mic element, and converts it to balanced mic level audio which is suitable for going a distance over wire. it also provides the bias voltage for the mic element to work.


              Originally posted by PhoenixUK View Post
              I have 2 of these, and an AP800, i am having trouble getting anything other than a small click from the mic when i tap it. The signal is tiny, and certainly not enough for vr. I have enabled phantom power, but what is this "drain" wire i see people mentioning please?
              Hopefully an obvious queson, but have you properly set the gain on that port? I would assume 60fb is required.


                i've always set the lgain on the AP800 using the software. I think it's Gware or something to that effect. it's been a while since i've touched one of those boxes. I think you can do it with the front panel as well, provided you have the version with the buttons on the front panel (it was available with a blank front panel at one point). I don't remember exactly what the available settings are for the mixer. if it's mic/line selectable, make sure it's set to mic, and the gain should be set so that the meter is hitting about 0dB when there's sound present. so my suggestion is to make noise similar to routine operation while watching the meter, and make adjustments as necessary to make your meters dance around 0dB. Do try to make sure there's as much seperation as possible between the normal background noise and the sound you're trying to pick up. The manual for the AP800 does a lot of explaining hor to operate the controls. you can find the manual at this link. Keep in mind Getner is now ClearOne.


                The crown mic also has adjustable sensitivity. you can adjust it by replacing and moving resistors on the board. the details are in the manual for the PZM11

                Once you get the audio passing thru the AP the way you want it, you may want to tweak the gate parameters to better suit the needs of VR in homeseer.

                If you're running program audio or TTS audio thru the AP800 to speakers around your home, the PA adaptive mode setting takes into account that audio and prevents that audio from activating any mics.

                The Max # of Mics setting should be as low as reasonably possible.

                You should usually leave the Last Mic Mode to Last On

                The Gate Ratio adjusts the delta between ambient level and the speech level.


                  Also, if you got this unit used, you might want to reset it to default to get rid of any previous changes. In particular make sure the following options are set for each mic input. the defaults are what you want.

                  make sure the inputs are set to mic level (This is default)

                  make sure the Mic Activation option is set to AutoGate mode (This is default)

                  Make sure phantom power is on (This is default)

                  Do not select any of the mic channels as the chairman mic (This is default)