Adding Z-Wave Switch to a Multi-switch Light

[david.delano]

I have an exterior light that is controlled by 3 switches, one interior, the other two exterior. I'd like to add motion detection to this light. I could wire the motion detector directly, but also want to be able to control the light from the switches. Thus, I want the detector to send the events and have HS3 turn the light on/off. I don't want to replace all three switches if I don't need to, especially since they are exterior. Can I replace the inside switch with a Z-Wave switch to add the control? I should not that this switch very rarely gets used - control is usually from the exterior switches. If I can replace just the one switch, which type of switch do I need?

David

[drhtmal]

You will need to replace all 3 of the existing switches and will have to wire it much differently than it probably is wired now. You can use the WC-100 Companion switches for 2 of the replacements and a WS-200 switch for controlling the load remotely via the motion sensor. You will also have to wire it so the motion sensor always has power and controls the load.

A lot depends on how the wires currently run between the electrical boxes with your existing switches and to the light that they are controlling.

[drhtmal]

Here is one of the most common ways 4-way switches are wired in newer homes.



Here is another common way

[david.delano]

I'm trying to integrate this sensor: https://shop.homeseer.com/products/h...odlight-sensor.

I thought I had the power figured out, but now I'm not sure. If I wired it in as a direct sensor, I'd have to leave the light switch on (?), and I wouldn't have a way to turn the light on with a switch. I could turn it off, but would then have to remember to turn it back on. I was hoping to get around all this by using the sensor standalone, but now I see that I wouldn't have the power to it that it needs.....

Any other suggested solutions? I could replace all three switches, but I'd have to make sure I could make the exterior switches water tight, which would be more work, but doable.

David

[drhtmal]

I have an HS-FLS100+. I don't have the 4-way switch, just a single switch.

It would cost a bit to implement the solution you suggested, about $120.00 just for the HomeSeer stuff. I don't think the HomeSeer switches are rated for outdoor use. You could use one of those outside switch cover plates, with a cover that flips down over the switch. The existing switch is outside. How it is currently protected?

1 x WS-200+ 44.95
1 x FLS-100+ 39.95
2 x WA-100+ 17.95
-------
Total 120.80

[outbackrob]

If you need it to be on the cheap, you could use GE Z-wave toggle switches and companions. They might stand the weather better if enclosed in a box vs a paddle. ~$75 for all three switches.

[chrisfraser05]

surely you can use a zwave module and wire all the switches as normal but instead of to the load they go to the module.

This is what we have done to multiple customers houses. 3 or 4 switches all turning the module on/off, but also zwave can do it too

[david.delano]

Just getting back to this. I have several Z-Wave switches on hand, though I don't know if I have any multi-way ones.

I may have misunderstood something. Can I wire in the motion detector so that the switches still work? My impression is that I'd have to leave the light on all the time, and not be able to turn it on manually, only via the motion detector.

[B1Trash]

There are a million ways to skin this cat... Let me try my hand. If you can mount the motion detector somewhere with constant power, then you can wire the rest of the switches to the light. Now the zwave switch controls power to the light, and the motion detector triggers your controller to turn the lights on and off.

[david.delano]

That was my original plan. However, the light is not currently on a Z-Wave switch, and I was trying to get by with just installing one Z-Wave switch in a 4-way setup.

chrisfraser05 - what do you mean by module?

[B1Trash]

That was my original plan. However, the light is not currently on a Z-Wave switch, and I was trying to get by with just installing one Z-Wave switch in a 4-way setup.

chrisfraser05 - what do you mean by module?

Unfortunately, as far as I understand I don't think you'll be able to get away with that.

The problem with this is that z-wave switches in a multi-switch setup work differently than traditional 3- and 4-way switches. Z-wave switches use accessory switches to signal the main switch. The main switch then controls the load. Traditional switches just use their different on/off combinations to open different wire paths to the device.

So if you want smart switching you will need all of your switches for that light to be smart (or smart accessory switches). The obvious option (and already suggested solution) is to wire in a Z-wave switch + accessory switches.. but there are plenty of alternatives.

The cheapest way to do smart control is to delete one or two of your switch positions... would you need/want to be able to toggle those switches if you're now automating the light? This could save ~$40 in accessory switches. You also wouldn't have to worry about weatherproofing the switches. The downside is the loss of the control locations.

Now you said you have multiple z-wave switches on hand. If you're trying to make do without purchasing new accessory switches, you can make this work with the equipment you already have. You can wire one of your extra z-wave switches directly to the load and then connect two more z-wave switches in the other locations, but don't connect the load wires. These other two are essentially z-wave remote controls that can talk to your controller to tell the first switch to control your light. This is the most expensive solution (if purchasing new) and just as useless as the previous one if your controller goes down. However, if you already have the switches on hand then cost is nil. A side benefit (maybe) is you would also have switches with status lights at all three locations.

[B1Trash]

Ok, I think I was wrong... take a look at the Aeotec Nano Switch:

https://aeotec.com/z-wave-outlet-socket

This one uses your existing switches and lives behind the scenes. You would need to run constant power to it though. If you will have unswitched power for the motion, this could live in the same housing as the motion and then be controlled by z-wave or your existing switch setup.

[NetworkGuy]

Just getting back to this. I have several Z-Wave switches on hand, though I don't know if I have any multi-way ones.

I may have misunderstood something. Can I wire in the motion detector so that the switches still work? My impression is that I'd have to leave the light on all the time, and not be able to turn it on manually, only via the motion detector.

If the motion sensor is between the switch and the light, then it will only get power when the switch is thrown (turned on). Is that correct? The motion sensor typically requires constant power for motion detection. Otherwise you would probably need to leave the light switch on with control passing to motion sensor.

You might also consider installing Aeotec micro-controllers into the exterior locations. It's not cheaper, but you can use your existing switches.

[NetworkGuy]

I'm trying to integrate this sensor: https://shop.homeseer.com/products/h...odlight-sensor.

I thought I had the power figured out, but now I'm not sure.

Do you have a way to pull a single wire (same gauge) from your switch (assuming this is where your power comes in) to the sensor location? This may be a tall task, but if possible, you could wire constant power to the sensor this way.

[david.delano]

More information.

I want to control a floodlight that is on the back of my shop, which backs onto the alley. There is one switch inside the shop. There are two external switches: one next to the gate to the alley, and one nearer the house. And, I just realized, this circuit also has another set of floodlights on the house side of the shop. I hadn't intended to turn them on, but I think that will be okay. The shop has open rafters, so wiring at the top isn't a problem. The walls are block, so rewiring the switch can be a pain. I can get to the inside switch, though, and I believe is a double gang with only one switch so plenty of room there.

I do have a couple of nano switches on hand. I had intended to use them for my spa jets, but I can always buy more. Can one of these be wired into the 4-way? I can run another hot wire to the motion detector instead of running it off the light power, and still mount it on the light box (I think I have one or two more holes in that box).

Longer term, I need to do something similar in the front of the house (I have 4 of the motion detectors).

David