What's your home automation dimmer strategy/choice?

[George]

You sure your wife isn't related to mine! Just let me forget to rinse off a dish when I take it back to the sink! Oy Vey!

[fresnoboy]

If you are doing a complete retrofit of lighting controls, I wouldn't use Zwave etc... I would go with a Lutron system like their Caseta. The resale value will be much better, and it has great HA support in HS via a plugin and use of their gateway. Super reliable, and not that much more expensive if at all. I don't think Zwave will be as reliable, and you want whoever buys the house next not have to have run something like HS to control it well.

[TC1]

If you are doing a complete retrofit of lighting controls, I wouldn't use Zwave etc... I would go with a Lutron system like their Caseta. The resale value will be much better, and it has great HA support in HS via a plugin and use of their gateway. Super reliable, and not that much more expensive if at all. I don't think Zwave will be as reliable, and you want whoever buys the house next not have to have run something like HS to control it well.

Does the Lutron system/devices support direct associations? One things that is great about Z-wave dimmers is that I can join separate light circuits together so they act as one, even without a controller. The moron who did the wiring for my under-cabinet lights put them on three separate circuits, by direct associating the three dimmers to each other, any one of them can operate all my under cab lights, so it acts like one circuit.

[outbackrob]

.... by direct associating the three dimmers to each other, any one of them can operate all my under cab lights, so it acts like one circuit.

Old dog question: What is the advantage of direct associating the dimmers vs having an event that turns on the other cabinet lights from each switch/dimmer?

[TC1]

Old dog question: What is the advantage of direct associating the dimmers vs having an event that turns on the other cabinet lights from each switch/dimmer?

Once the Z-wave association is programmed into the dimmers, it will work without a home automation system being present/operational.

[fresnoboy]

Does the Lutron system/devices support direct associations? One things that is great about Z-wave dimmers is that I can join separate light circuits together so they act as one, even without a controller. The moron who did the wiring for my under-cabinet lights put them on three separate circuits, by direct associating the three dimmers to each other, any one of them can operate all my under cab lights, so it acts like one circuit.

I use a different Lutron system in my home, but I am pretty sure all the Lutron line allows grouping of lights like that, and the interfaces to automation looks like HS pushing a button a virtual keypad, etc...

[randman]

If you are doing a complete retrofit of lighting controls, I wouldn't use Zwave etc... I would go with a Lutron system like their Caseta. The resale value will be much better, and it has great HA support in HS via a plugin and use of their gateway. Super reliable, and not that much more expensive if at all. I don't think Zwave will be as reliable, and you want whoever buys the house next not have to have run something like HS to control it well.

I'm wondering the same thing as the OP. Currently, all the switches in my home are Z-Wave (only counting light switches, I probably have 60 switches, all using Z-Wave). I use Alexa, as well as HomeKit (using the Homebridge-HomeSeer4 plugin). I may be moving to another home, so I'm trying to figure out if I want to stick with Z-Wave or use Lutron Caseta for my light switches.

For me, the main advantage of the Lutron is that its hub works natively with Alexa, HomeKit and Google Assistant. I still plan on using HomeSeer for its event engine, but it is nice to not have to be dependent on HomeSeer for Alexa and HomeKit integration. The Lutron Caseta has a maximum limit of 75 devices, but I think this ought to be sufficient. For all my lamps, I use Philips Hue (which also has the advantage of not being dependent on a third party hub such as HomeSeer for Alexa and HomeKit integration).

I looked briefly into the Lutron RA2 Select and RadioRA 2, but it seems their hardware is harder to get (and more expensive).

While Lutron Caseta doesn't use a "mesh" protocol like Z-Wave, Caseta does support a repeater and a dimmer that can server as a second repeater if needed. I would think this is sufficient for a good size home. Even with Z-Wave, I've always strived for not being reliant on the "mesh" network. Direct connection always seemed more reliable (hence, I have two Z-NETs).

Anyone else here switched from Z-Wave to Lutron Caseta? I'd like to hear your thoughts on pros/cons. Note that I would still use Z-Wave for other devices (that are not light switches), such as water valves, some sensors, MimoLite, etc. So, I'm interested mainly in light switches and whether to move from Z-Wave to Caseta for them.

[fresnoboy]

I have been relatively unimpressed with the Z-wave stuff for lighting. If you want to use a mesh, I would go for zigbee, which despite running in the 2.4 GHz band in my house, not only has been extremely reliable (at least with the jowihue plugin and a conbee USB radio), much faster in turning devices on and off. While the bulbs and sensors are cheaper and more available than zwave, there are very few wall switches available for zigbee vs Zwave. It may be the case the reliability problems with Zwave are homeseer specific, but given comments on other HA system forums, I think HS support seems rather good on a relative basis.

The Lutron stuff is very very solid. And you can set it up so you aren't depending on HS being up for base level functions, which I think is important. Not because HS is unreliable, it isn't, but my principle is that HA is best used for INTEGRATION, and not as a remote control. I want my HVAC, security, lighting, AV control to work well in standalone modes, and have the HA integrate the sensors and device controls to deliver automation value.

I should hardly ever need to use HS touch etc... or the HS website, but the automation should be running in the background, fusing sensor data and coordinating things. I think my harmony remote is better than something I could cobble together in HSmobile on my phone. Likewise an HStouch wall tablet is less good in my mind from a UI and form factor POV compared to a Lutron keypad or switch, or a Nest or Ecobee thermostat on the wall.

I also think HS plays a important role in making Google assistant or alexa devices much more useful. They are not particularly good at automation, though getting better. Having HS act as intermediary between different lighting technologies and automation logic and the google home devices makes them much more useful. And programming automation in HS via keyboard is much quicker than using apps... For AV and media playback, Google devices integrate very nicely with my choromecast audios and TV's, etc..., so I don't involve HS in media playback at all anymore, whereas several years ago I did.

So I think you need to think about what your control and automation philosophy is, and pick systems that conform to that. For me, Lutron was the best choice by far for my home lighting, though I use zigbee bulbs in table tamps and such (with HS bridging the two systems together), and landscape lighting is done with Zwave (though I may eventually move that to zigbee as well).

Thx
mike

[George]

I have been relatively unimpressed with the Z-wave stuff for lighting. If you want to use a mesh, I would go for zigbee, which despite running in the 2.4 GHz band in my house, not only has been extremely reliable (at least with the jowihue plugin and a conbee USB radio), much faster in turning devices on and off. While the bulbs and sensors are cheaper and more available than zwave, there are very few wall switches available for zigbee vs Zwave. It may be the case the reliability problems with Zwave are homeseer specific, but given comments on other HA system forums, I think HS support seems rather good on a relative basis.

Thx
mike

Mike, thanks for the insight. When I built the home 20+ years ago it was based on my use of X-10 and wall switches. So most all of my lighting is wall switch controlled, hence the lack of motivation to move to Zigbee as not many devices have constant predictable power. That plus the WAF factor that she likes to press a paddle and not go to her iPhone to turn a light on or off causes some reluctance. I did buy the Conbee Stick but it's still in it's box and appreciate the pointer to the plugin).

Is there a source that you use that I can research just what is out there for the Zigbee world. I've already invested in Z-Wave locks and that was a serious investment that I wouldn't want to throw away. As for Z-Wave, yes, HS has a lot of issues with Z-Wave but I have mainly worked around them, so I don't get hung by my fingernails, by restarting the plugin every 3.5 hours. Sometimes it still goes wonky inside that period but I've defined a Z-Home Plus event I can manually trigger to restart the plugin.

If there were some lights like outdoor landscape lighting for example, that can be easily controlled by a schedule that would be a serious consideration.

At our age, light bulbs that change colors doesn't float our boat, if you know what I mean.

So, if there someplace, other than just doing a Zigbee search on Amazon, that might show me availability and penetration of Zigbee?

[TC1]

I'll just state, since I did start this topic, that I disagree with a lot that's been said. My Z-wave lighting control is rock solid and a lot of it is designed to not be dependent on a bridge/hub. Z-wave direct associations were specifically designed into the protocol to eliminate the need for a hub and to speed reaction times between trigger devices (usually sensors) and target devices.

Through research, experimentation and cost analysis, I've decided that that my lighting load controllers will stay Z-wave, but I'm now utilizing Zigbee sensors (temp, humidity, motion) since they are dirt cheap and have long battery life (1+ years). The integration of a Conbee2 Zigbee controller with it's REST API means status updates from Zigbee devices are instantaneous, unlike the polling of the Hue bridge and plugin that a lot of folks use. And the support for the Nortek Zigbee controller that HST provides is piss poor, in terms of devices supported.

The only place I'll still use Z-wave sensors is for direct associations. All of my closet and pantry doors now have Z-wave door sensors and light switches, the WAF went from skeptical to now she expects every light in the world to go on automatically when she opens a door, lol.

I also have Z-wave dimmers on different load circuits that mirror each other, without having to utilize a hub, ie, HS and events.

But hey, to each their own. There's a million and one ways to skin a cat.

[fresnoboy]

I think if you look at aliexpress and amazon, etc..., you see zwave has being much stronger in the US compared with zigbee, which tends to be much stronger across the world, particularly in Chinese ecosystems. Sonoff, tuya, xioami, etc.. all make zigbee based products, but nothing z-wave.

I run HS3, so my zwave experience may be different than HS4 users. I am sure people have done things to make it work really well, else devices would not be so popular. But I know the hubitat folks have had zwave problems as well, and I am sot sure where the problem is. My issues have not been HS based but with the Mesh reachability.

If zwave is working well for you, by all means stick with it!

My outdoor landscaping lights are controlled by normal smart plugs that sit in waterproof cases (https://www.homedepot.com/p/SOCKiT-B...s&locale=en-US). This let use normal plugs instead of outdoor rated switches, and I have a bunch of transformers all in one location, so I can put all the controller plugs in one of these.


The one thing that I couldn't easily replace with zigbee is a dome ball valve controller that shuts off the gas line to my bbq area at night. I have had enough problems caused by me leaving the grill on that when we moved to the new house, I made sure I had an automated gas valve so that I could include a failsafe that would shut the valve off every night if it was done. It doesn't do good things to a grill if the gas is left on and lit at high for 2 days! I use a HS zwave decora style switch in the BBQ area to run out a light, and I programmed it to do a double tap to turn the valve on and off to control the valve as well. So if I want to BBQ, I just double tap the wall switch in the on position, and HS turns the gas valve on. No mobile devices required.

thx
mike

[TC1]

Off topic: since you mentioned NG bbq'ing.... I'm a huge BBQ and smoking guy... use propane... and i just realized that since the utility company moved my NG meter to near my patio area... there's external piping there now. Hmm.......

The wife ain't gonna like this

[fresnoboy]

Off topic: since you mentioned NG bbq'ing.... I'm a huge BBQ and smoking guy... use propane... and i just realized that since the utility company moved my NG meter to near my patio area... there's external piping there now. Hmm.......

The wife ain't gonna like this

Ha... Yes, NG piped grills are SO easy. We live in CA so the weather is pretty good for grilling all year round - not much rain. So we grill a lot, and not worrying about when we have to fill the bottle is a great thing. You should be able to find an LP tyo NG conversion kit, so if the price for an NG hookup is not bad, I would definitely make that happen.

We also have a insulated vertical smoker that uses charcoal, but I have a fan hooked up to a Fireboard Wifi controller ( www.fireboard.com ), which I really like. Lots of temp probes, and fan control. Once I light the pit (I love these LooftLight units (https://www.amazon.com/Looftlighter-.../dp/B000WYY65Y)), the fan controller maintains temps, and I never have to open the cabinet to check on things. For a brisket or pork butt that takes more than 12 hrs, I can start it in the evening, and the controller will maintain target temp in the night so makes overnight cooks easy!

There is even a plugin for the fireboard in HS: https://forums.homeseer.com/forum/ul...hnology?f=1591

[TC1]

I have one of the few thermostatically controlled propane smokers on the market, so once I set it it stays rock steady (+/- a few degrees). I get a 4 hours worth of smoking by using a stainless steel pellet tube. But the reality is I'd like more smoke (for overnight smokes), close to what a stick burner setup does. And I already own a FireBoard (like I said, I'm a hardcore BBQ guy) so will more than likely purchase a charcoal smoker and use the FB for fan control.

But the new Masterbuilts are intriguing.... https://www.masterbuilt.com/collecti...l-grill-smoker

So many toys to try, so little time....

[Wade]

I have one of the few thermostatically controlled propane smokers on the market, so once I set it it stays rock steady (+/- a few degrees). I get a 4 hours worth of smoking by using a stainless steel pellet tube. But the reality is I'd like more smoke (for overnight smokes), close to what a stick burner setup does. And I already own a FireBoard (like I said, I'm a hardcore BBQ guy) so will more than likely purchase a charcoal smoker and use the FB for fan control.

But the new Masterbuilts are intriguing.... https://www.masterbuilt.com/collecti...l-grill-smoker

So many toys to try, so little time....

Need to move to an OT thread...what are your thoughts on pellet smokers? Looking at a Recteq.