Normal (?) Number of Power outages

[travisdh]

Hello All,

I am not sure if it is just me being ignorant, but when i rebuilt my HA Server i put a UPS on it, all of the sudden I have the ability to monitor when the power is off, and when the power is on.

Anyway for the most part everything seemed to work quite well, however of late I seem to be noticing a much greater number of very quick (10 - 20 second) power outages that the UPS reports.

We recently had a smart meter installed, and I am wondering if that could / would have anything to do with it?.

I run X10 in my house, and between the smart meter and the house is a whole house X10 filter otherwise it is a normal house. I got the UPS last year (later in the year) but the power outages seem to be more of a recent thing.

Thanks for your thoughts.


An example of the log is below:

BLUPS Log
This displays all power failures and restores logged by the plug-in.

Date/Time Log Description
2/12/2013 10:25:24 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 14 secs.
2/12/2013 10:25:09 PM Power failure has occurred.
2/12/2013 10:52:29 AM Power has been restored. The power was off for 14 secs.
2/12/2013 10:52:14 AM Power failure has occurred.
2/11/2013 12:19:29 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 14 secs.
2/11/2013 12:19:14 PM Power failure has occurred.
2/10/2013 4:14:49 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 10 secs.
2/10/2013 4:14:38 PM Power failure has occurred.
2/7/2013 8:25:50 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 15 secs.
2/7/2013 8:25:35 PM Power failure has occurred.
2/6/2013 5:06:53 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 15 secs.
2/6/2013 5:06:38 PM Power failure has occurred.
2/4/2013 5:28:54 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 14 secs.
2/4/2013 5:28:39 PM Power failure has occurred.
2/3/2013 12:15:05 AM Power has been restored. The power was off for 14 secs.
2/3/2013 12:14:50 AM Power failure has occurred.
2/2/2013 5:07:48 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 4 secs.
2/2/2013 5:07:44 PM Power failure has occurred.
1/31/2013 8:07:27 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 10 secs.
1/31/2013 8:07:16 PM Power failure has occurred.
1/31/2013 6:57:56 PM Power has been restored. The power was off for 10 secs.
1/31/2013 6:57:45 PM Power failure has occurred.
1/28/2013 3:56:54 AM Power has been restored. The power was off for 14 secs.
1/28/2013 3:56:39 AM Power failure has occurred.
1/24/2013 2:37:08 AM Power has been restored. The power was off for 14 secs.
1/24/2013 2:36:53 AM Power failure has occurred.
1/22/2013 6:12:07 AM Power has been restored. The power was off for 15 secs.
1/22/2013 6:11:52 AM Power failure has occurred.
1/17/2013 8:50:40 AM Power has been restored. The power was off for 11 mins, 6 secs.
1/17/2013 8:39:33 AM Power failure has occurred.

[Wadenut]

What type of UPS is this?
I would think, if the power had been off that long (eg 14 secs) you'd be noticing it. IE. Digital clocks, etc. constantly having to be reset.

My APC UPS often reports switching to battery momentarily when the voltage dips, but not power outages, except when we actually have a bump or real outage.

[travisdh]

Its not a fancy ups (as in a great quality one) just a
CyberPower BRIC-LCD 650VA / 390W Line Interactive UPS BR650ELCD because all it runs is a low power PC, and a modem and wireless router, most of the time the fluctuations / outages are when i am at work or away from home so i don't notice them, that said the other night i did notice a quick 10 second power outage detected by the UPS as well.

I wonder then if it is detecting a power dip and treating it as a power failure, switching over to UPS power for 5 seconds, rechecking then reverting back to mains power.

[travisdh]

Also surprisingly not that many digital clocks in the house, far to many electronic devices but most restart themselves automatically, and time sync so they don't get too bothered by it all. The one thing i did have was a poorly designed TV which when the power came on, it would automatically turn itself on, this lives in the bathroom and many a time I would come home and this was on.

[Wadenut]

I wonder then if it is detecting a power dip and treating it as a power failure, switching over to UPS power for 5 seconds, rechecking then reverting back to mains power.

That would be my guess.

[travisdh]

Thanks

[Wadenut]

Thanks

For what it was worth

[Pete]

Travis,

Never actually used the BLUPS plugin but have added Cyberpower UPS's here to my older APC UPS's over the last couple of years. They are the 1500 type.

I installed the plugin with no issues to my current HSPro V.76 build.

I did have a number of short power outages this last summer here. Not had any recently though.

I do not currently have a smart meter installed.

More curious what I see in the logs from the UPS and will watch a bit here.

A couple of years back got a bit granular watching the power with a Radio Shack multimeter with an RS-232 port on it. It was interesting to watch the graphs of the power going into the house.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...3&locale=en_US

http://www.radioshack.com/graphics/u...0812_PM_EN.pdf

[ameridan]

I wrote a script to keep track of my my power interuptions as well, based on the plugin tenHsPower and my APC Back-UPS ES 550VA. I too experience several 5 second interuptions that don't affect my digital clocks, but are probably really happening. I don't think (hope) they are related to the smart meter, as I was getting them before I got my smart meter, as shown in the log.

POWER OFFLINE @ 8/7/2011 10:29:00 PM (STORM, TREE FELL)
POWER ONLINE @ 8/8/2011 1:46:48 AM (3+ HOURS)
POWER OFFLINE @ 8/9/2011 11:37:55 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 8/9/2011 11:38:00 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 8/24/2011 10:21:53 PM (STORM, TREE FELL)
POWER ONLINE @ 8/26/2011 3:48:50 AM (28+ HOURS)
POWER OFFLINE @ 11/1/2011 11:02:38 AM (SMART METER UPGRADE)
POWER ONLINE @ 11/1/2011 11:02:43 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 12/1/2011 12:04:12 PM
POWER ONLINE @ 12/1/2011 12:04:17 PM
POWER OFFLINE @ 5/4/2012 2:37:38 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 5/4/2012 2:37:43 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 5/5/2012 4:47:09 PM
POWER ONLINE @ 5/5/2012 4:47:14 PM
POWER OFFLINE @ 5/13/2012 9:37:26 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 5/13/2012 9:37:51 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 7/3/2012 6:30:23 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 7/3/2012 6:30:28 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 7/3/2012 7:27:28 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 7/3/2012 7:27:33 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 7/5/2012 4:50:04 AM (STORM, TREE FELL)
POWER ONLINE @ 7/6/2012 5:25:47 PM (36+ HOURS)
POWER OFFLINE @ 7/13/2012 8:00:58 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 7/13/2012 8:01:03 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 7/26/2012 5:59:48 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 7/26/2012 5:59:53 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 8/10/2012 5:48:47 PM (LIGHTNING)
POWER ONLINE @ 8/11/2012 1:04:23 PM (19+ HOURS)
POWER OFFLINE @ 8/31/2012 11:57:33 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 8/31/2012 11:57:38 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 8/31/2012 12:58:13 PM (RAIN, TREE FELL)
POWER ONLINE @ 8/31/2012 6:42:38 PM (5+ HOURS)
POWER OFFLINE @ 10/15/2012 11:21:28 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 10/15/2012 11:21:33 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 11/2/2012 7:50:03 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 11/2/2012 7:50:08 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 11/2/2012 7:50:18 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 11/2/2012 7:50:23 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 11/2/2012 9:43:53 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 11/2/2012 9:43:58 AM
POWER OFFLINE @ 11/11/2012 3:13:30 PM
POWER ONLINE @ 11/11/2012 3:13:35 PM
POWER OFFLINE @ 11/12/2012 12:05:20 PM
POWER ONLINE @ 11/12/2012 12:05:25 PM
POWER OFFLINE @ 1/11/2013 1:33:22 AM (RAIN, TREE FELL)
POWER ONLINE @ 1/11/2013 12:04:25 PM (10+ HOURS)
POWER OFFLINE @ 1/20/2013 1:25:46 AM (STRONG WINDS, TREE FELL)
POWER ONLINE @ 1/21/2013 4:25:12 PM (39 HOURS)
POWER OFFLINE @ 1/28/2013 3:22:47 AM
POWER ONLINE @ 1/28/2013 3:22:52 AM

I'm hoping I can use the report to get my power company to do something about all the dead ash trees that keep falling on the power lines.

[drozwood90]

I will also state, that when I was seeing a LOT of quick dropouts, I was concerned as well. What I believe is happening is the battery is being checked out by the unit. Most power battery backups run off the MAINS. So, it needs to check the health of the battery every once in a while. That is what you are seeing.

There are 3 main types of battery backups. They have technical names, but I do not know what they are.

• Cheapy, which tend to take a moderate time to come online, and use modified sine
• "normal" which take only as long as the relay to come online, use a heavily filtered modified sine (low end), or on the high end pure sine <-- most "decent" battery backups fall into this category
• "top of the line", pure sine and run off of it's internal battery 100% of the time - this buffers the power against all outtages and overshoots. They are really expensive and batteries go pretty fast on them, but 100% uptime, never have power problems with these guys. They tend to be out of my price range.

--Dan

[Pete]

Yeah here I got a deal on the Cyberpower 1500's at Fry's for a bit under $100.

They do use the words "simulated sinewave" in their description as if it is something new. I guess the verbiage is though.

Cyberpower next model up though are advertised a pure sinewave output UPS's.

I did try a few different types though with my current mostly APCs and found that I liked the Cyberpower ones the best.

[drozwood90]

Pete,

I value your opinion (as most here do), what do you like better about the Cyberpower units?

---- most can skip the below rambling...am I getting old? I like to recount older stories, and I was talking to my kids about the RC car I pulled out of the basement and it shocked me when I said, the car was older than them - and I thought about it, it was about 20 years old. I think that shocked me more, I was dealing in decades of time for something.

When I was in IT, I did a comparison between 3 brands. Ended up with APC due to how well it integrated with everything. So, I think I have not even considered other brands as of now.

Especially, since APC has "sucked" me in by keeping track of the battery. And they do a good job, right about when the battery inside my UPS goes bad, I get a letter from them offering me an upgrade to a WHOLE new unit at a pretty heavily discounted price. Well, it used to be. Now it feels more like a sale price at a local place. BUT, what is really nice about it, it ends up costing me less than buying a new one, they mail me a whole new model + battery (generally it is an upgrade to what I got last time, and I paid about the same every year so far). I also get an empty box to put my current unit in, once I swap out the old for the new, postage paid, I mail the other unit back in their box. I don't even have to leave my house. FedEx picks up and drops off both units.

VERY nice setup. It is why I keep going with them. Although, this time, the one they sent me has an accessory port to plug in an extended battery in the back. I have been tempted to get the connector and try to plug in a sealed lead-acid of large capacity. Right now the unit runs for about 10-15 minutes on battery. With the extended capacity...or an after market BULK deep cycle, I think I could make that a few hours.

--Dan

[Pete]

Personally I have amassed APC (have maybe 6-7 of them), Tripp Lite and now the Cyberpower UPS's over the last 30 years. Note this is for my personal home use.

I have dealt with APC customer service and they are top notch. On the other hand the Tripp Lite looks like a model from the 1980's and appears to just be still manufacturered new as they were in the the 1980's.

I have not dealt with Cyberpower CS (good thing); so I really don't know if they have good or bad customer service. I also know that the basic functionality is the same for the three UPS's.

That said; Cyberpower appears to have built a product to compete with their peers relating to footprint, functionality, et al.

Competition is healthy and right now Cyberpower is my personal favorite.

On the other hand for "work" stuff having to deal with thousands (literally) of an installed base of APC UPS's the brand was all that I ever was involved with. That and having the ability to test and ask APC for more effective means of managing, et al worked for me.

BTW Dan; decades of time will come faster with age....10 years will be like yesterday and 50 will be like last week...really though just short "dog" years ....

I deleted my "old man" ramblings here...
===> .

[Monk]

I too had a collection of huge APC units. Battery replacement cost was greater than the cost of a brand new "CyberPower".
I now have a handful of them in the house, none has failed yet.