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    #31
    Originally posted by rjh View Post
    THere is no question there is more work involved with working with an HS system, but you really can do anything you want. If you only want basic control, then a $99 hub will probably do the job. If you want VR, text-to-speech, Infrared control, an open API (various methods), .NET support, then you cannot use a SmartThings like system. Also, check their list of supported Z-Wave devices, its really pretty small. We also offer customization of many Z-Wave devices using available parameters, right from the UI, no one else does this, you are stuck with the defaults. You want to customize the mobile, app, forget it.

    The HS user and SmartThings user are very different and we are not catering to the ST user. If all you want is to spend is $99 on your controller, you are giving away access to your system to cloud. The first time your internet (or their server) goes down and your mobile app cannot unlock your door, the wife will have you throw it all away!

    Keep in mind that when someone buys a system, they are motivated to make it work and phrase it even though they may be suffering with a lack of features.

    When I look at ST it seems that they are becoming more like HS all the time. They do have something similar to events, local processing (now), and an interactive community. Sure it is less capable than HS, but if you are new to automation HS becomes more and more difficult to pick because of the time it takes to setup--as I'm sure you are aware. So while HS tries to simplify for the less technical user ST started simple and is extending for the more technical user over time. On 2/24/2017 at 4:32 PM eastern time they will be feature identical. Though ST will still be owned by a company that really really really seems to not respect their users privacy.

    With respect to cloudness. With the new ST hub it is supposed to continue to work sans internet. While HS will work without internet (except for all the IFTTT/weather...type things) it will appear to not work to the wife when HSTouch fails to connect--which unfortunately is quite often with myhs and the latest HSTouch3 iOS client.

    I would say that today the biggest strengths of HS are:

    1. It runs on almost anything--including actual full blown Windows
    2. Events (enough said)
    3. Ease of extending via plugins/plugin store
    4. Z-wave plugin itself is almost certainly the best z-wave interface anywhere
    5. Custom UI via HSTouch Designer (with a big caveat that it is incredibly time consuming and frustrating)


    While it is good to keep an eye on the other players, it is probably more important for HS to continue to do what it does best.
    _______________________________________________

    HS3 : HSpro (3.0.0.460) on Win2012 (vm on ESXi)
    Plugins: HSTouch, UPBSpud, Kinect, Nest, IFTTT, DirecTV, EasyTrigger, Imperihome, Zwave, RFXcom, UltraMon3, UltraWeatherBug3, UltraGCIR3, UltraLog3, UltraPioneer, PHLocation, Pushover, Pushalot, MCSSPrinklers S, JowiHue
    Jon00 Plugins: Bluetooth Proximity, Performance Monitor, DB Chart, Links

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      #32
      Originally posted by mrhappy View Post
      I think that a high degree of unhappiness with HS is from people who know what HS could be with enough time dedicated to it, myself included.

      I imagine that trying to deal with a customer base of people which include software developers and people with above average knowledge of IT stuff must be a nightmare because they know how capable the software could be and know how easy some bugs could be to fix. With the all in one smart hub type products you might be dealing with users who are a little more in the dark about how things work and of course probably have ten times as much money behind them which no doubt helps.
      I have a very broad knowledge of electronics, computers and programming - probably not too deep in a lot of areas. I am also a confirmed pragmatist. I have never been unhappy with HomeSeer. I was very frustrated early in 2014, because of Z-Wave issues, but the core program was reliable from the start. I did find a couple of fatal bugs in Event conditions which were sorted by spring 2014. As of September 2014 I have had no frustration. My system has been stone reliable. The Event logic made perfect sense to me from the beginning. I have never had an event to perform exactly as I expect it to, unless my logic is flawed.

      Where my pragmatism affects the situation is when Aeon (or any company) releases a new product and it does not work, I am patient in waiting for HomeSeer and/or the company to get the bugs worked out.

      I truly think HS3 has become a much more mature product than it was when I started.

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        #33
        This may be long and boring, but I hope to convey a point.

        Years ago I toyed with Heath computers. When Zenith Electronics purchased Heath, they formed Zenith Data Systems. My company became a dealer and service center in 1981. Shortly thereafter they introduced the innovative S-100 buss Z-100. The company came out with many more innovative products and were quite ahead of the rest of the industry from the start. When I visited their offices I met a very enthusiastic group of people who were committed to quality and innovation, a trait carried over from the television division. They were quite happy being a niche player as long as they were the best. Even after they sold to Groupe Bull they came out with the Z-Note and Z-Note color. During that same time of very good innovation, they also got some very large and lucrative government contracts. This was because the new French ownership wanted to aggressively grow their market share. To get these contracts they over promised, resulting in cheaper components and really bad long term liabilities. They merged with Packard Bell to stop the bleeding and in short order all companies were gone.

        This is an example of a company that was at the top of their game, very innovative and profitable, but with a tiny slice of the PC market. Their move to dramatically increase their market share ended up killing the one thing that set them apart. It is possible that if they stayed after innovation and were content with slow growth, they might have survived.

        I have ridden BMW motorcycles for years, starting with old airheads and currently the new flagship K1600GTL. This is another company that has always been innovative, from the first shaft drive, the first unique Paralever rear suspension and Telelever (and the subsequent Duolever) front suspension, the first fuel injection, the first ABS, the first cruise control an so on. They have always been a very small slice of the US motorcycle market. I developed a close relationship with the US arm of the company in 2002 due to a charity I helped found and later a dedicated pair of web communities that support the brand. I had numerous meetings and phone conversations with their marketing and technical staff members. As a company they have remained committed to quality and innovation on the motorcycle side and remained content looking for a slow build in their market share.

        This is a company that has remained true to their roots and kept a consistent mission. They are one of the most successful brands in terms of consistent growth and when the floor fell out from under Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki and even Harley Davidson in the 2007-2008 recession, they still showed modest growth. Over the last 5-6 years their growth has been strong as has their innovation. The Quandt family has remained true to their founding principals and the product that really launched the brand that it is today, despite the fact that the car division has totally eclipsed the motorcycle division.

        The point of all of this is that I see a lot of similarities in HomeSeer, clearly committed to innovation with a product that is unique in the marketplace and an opportunity to continue to build on that foundation. I realize that HomeSeer is orders of magnitude smaller than the two examples above, yet in this market they are similarly poised. I think there are many opportunities and it feels like HomeSeer is exploring many of them. Who knows what the future will bring - we all know predictions are especially difficult when they have to do with the future

        Even though I have volunteered to create content for the Event Clinic forum, I have no business relationship with HomeSeer, I receive no compensation and have no special relationship with anyone at the company.
        Last edited by randy; September 5, 2015, 04:29 PM.

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