Homeseer mention

[randy]

I would not trust my home to any of the big companies, but recently Samsung has annoyed me to the point, that I would open my life to Google before I use their products related to home automation.

I have had business relationships with Samsung that proved them to be blatantly unethical and dishonest. I certainly wouldn't trust them with any aspect of my personal life, even home automation.

[randy]

I love Apple, they do make some great products and their stock is going to fund at least a year of my retirement (assuming it stays about 100).

However I for one do not trust Apple in the slightest for something like this. Apple has continually demonstrated contempt for standards, embracing them only when they have no choice (and then pretending like they are huge standards evangelists). They also have contempt for the home hobbyist. Frankly, when it comes to computers Apple lost me the day they found out that people were popping the cases on the macs to mod them and reacted not by embracing the community, but by switching to a type of screw that most people would not have tools for in order to prevent people from modding the computers they purchased. For as cool as the Mac was at the time, after that dick move I knew I would never purchase a computer from Apple.

The reason I say I trust Apple is only because I feel (at least right now) that they have the utmost respect for my privacy. They don't share information and it doesn't look like they can even be coerced or forced to share it.

As far as their closed architecture and other things they do to protect their IP, that is a whole other thing.

[mikedr]

The reason I say I trust Apple is only because I feel (at least right now) that they have the utmost respect for my privacy. They don't share information and it doesn't look like they can even be coerced or forced to share it.

As far as their closed architecture and other things they do to protect their IP, that is a whole other thing.

That's a good point. As a general rule, I wouldn't want my HA system to be cloud-based -- apart from privacy, just reliability. I trust me more than a cloud provider, for better or worse.

[mikedr]

I have had business relationships with Samsung that proved them to be blatantly unethical and dishonest. I certainly wouldn't trust them with any aspect of my personal life, even home automation.

And the worst part is that they're 1,000 times better than a Chinese company. :\

[mrhappy]

The reason I say I trust Apple is only because I feel (at least right now) that they have the utmost respect for my privacy. They don't share information and it doesn't look like they can even be coerced or forced to share it.

As far as their closed architecture and other things they do to protect their IP, that is a whole other thing.

As someone who has dealt with Apple through my employment and tried to get them to give information out I can confirm that the Apple department I dealt with were not interested in disclosing anything or helping at all, whatsoever. I know customers will sleep easily knowing their data is safe but so will the people I was going to put in prison for 2-3+ years because Apple's reluctance to help means no prison for them!

[jlrichar]

I love Apple, they do make some great products and their stock is going to fund at least a year of my retirement (assuming it stays about 100).

However I for one do not trust Apple in the slightest for something like this. Apple has continually demonstrated contempt for standards, embracing them only when they have no choice (and then pretending like they are huge standards evangelists). They also have contempt for the home hobbyist. Frankly, when it comes to computers Apple lost me the day they found out that people were popping the cases on the macs to mod them and reacted not by embracing the community, but by switching to a type of screw that most people would not have tools for in order to prevent people from modding the computers they purchased. For as cool as the Mac was at the time, after that dick move I knew I would never purchase a computer from Apple.

Also, I hate that they moved to only selling laptops with Memory modules soldered down. In my mind this is not a computer--its a disposable consumer electronics device. Unfortunately I seem to be in the minority since all the HW vendors now sell slim laptops with at least the memory soldered, and sometimes even the SSD.

[AshaiRey]

However I for one do not trust Apple in the slightest for something like this. Apple has continually demonstrated contempt for standards, embracing them only when they have no choice (and then pretending like they are huge standards evangelists). They also have contempt for the home hobbyist. Frankly, when it comes to computers Apple lost me the day they found out that people were popping the cases on the macs to mod them and reacted not by embracing the community, but by switching to a type of screw that most people would not have tools for in order to prevent people from modding the computers they purchased. For as cool as the Mac was at the time, after that dick move I knew I would never purchase a computer from Apple.

Really, really good point that you mention this. For HA i don't trust Apple, never did, never will. Nor Google or any other cloud/online based home automation. HA should stay on premises in my opinion. If you don't want to put yourself in danger then only retrieve data that's needed at the core such as weather info. Don't allow control by 3th parties

[spike5884]

Not all Mentions are good.

Saw a post on Facebook about SmartThings under Z-Wave, which lead to a SmartThings vs Homeseer post.
https://community.smartthings.com/t/...homeseer/10715

A lot of Homeseer bashing going on there.

The Homeseer peeps might want to get some posts on the Z-Wave Home Automation FaceBook Group to get Homeseer out there too.

[rjh]

THere is no question there is more work involved with working with an HS system, but you really can do anything you want. If you only want basic control, then a $99 hub will probably do the job. If you want VR, text-to-speech, Infrared control, an open API (various methods), .NET support, then you cannot use a SmartThings like system. Also, check their list of supported Z-Wave devices, its really pretty small. We also offer customization of many Z-Wave devices using available parameters, right from the UI, no one else does this, you are stuck with the defaults. You want to customize the mobile, app, forget it.

The HS user and SmartThings user are very different and we are not catering to the ST user. If all you want is to spend $99 on your controller, you are giving away access to your system to cloud. The first time your internet (or their server) goes down and your mobile app cannot unlock your door, the wife will have you throw it all away!

Keep in mind that when someone buys a system, they are motivated to make it work and phrase it even though they may be suffering with a lack of features.

Saw a post on Facebook about SmartThings under Z-Wave, which lead to a SmartThings vs Homeseer post.
https://community.smartthings.com/t/...homeseer/10715

A lot of Homeseer bashing going on there.

The Homeseer peeps might want to get some posts on the Z-Wave Home Automation FaceBook Group to get Homeseer out there too.

[TomTom]

Homeseer mention

Yeah SmartThings is waiting to be the AshleyMadison of home automation. Neither of which the wife would want.
Reading Mark's link to SmartThings users complaining of their lights not coming on and other activities coming on in middle of the night cause their cloud system was sporadic sounded horrific! I can tell you I would be sleeping in the shed if this happened in the middle of the night. We are both working professionals and reliability due to our schedules is top priority for us and I believe for most folks( esp with kids).


Sent from my iPhone

[macromark]

Keep in mind that when someone buys a system, they are motivated to make it work and phrase it even though they may be suffering with a lack of features.

This is a vitally important insight and there is a great deal of psychology behind it. It's very difficult to admit you've made a mistake with a purchase and many people are motivated to make things work, no matter how convoluted or complicated the solution may be. In fact, the more time you spend on "work-arounds", the more invested you become! We see this all the time.

I remember a walk-in customer some months ago. He was picking up a wall switch he'd ordered online and we struck up a conversation. He was using a Vera Lite and wanted to tell me about the various scripts he had written to manage "scenes" (Vera's term for "events") with conditions. I brought up one of our systems and showed him how he could do the same thing with HS3 in about 15 seconds. His jaw dropped! Then I switched gears and showed him how he could customize HSTouch. More jaw-dropping! Nevertheless, he said he'd stick with Vera for now because of all the work he's already poured into it. Like I said, it's just human nature.

[S-F]

This is a vitally important insight and there is a great deal of psychology behind it. It's very difficult to admit you've made a mistake with a purchase and many people are motivated to make things work, no matter how convoluted or complicated the solution may be. In fact, the more time you spend on "work-arounds", the more invested you become! We see this all the time.

I remember a walk-in customer some months ago. He was picking up a wall switch he'd ordered online and we struck up a conversation. He was using a Vera Lite and wanted to tell me about the various scripts he had written to manage "scenes" (Vera's term for "events") with conditions. I brought up one of our systems and showed him how he could do the same thing with HS3 in about 15 seconds. His jaw dropped! Then I switched gears and showed him how he could customize HSTouch. More jaw-dropping! Nevertheless, he said he'd stick with Vera for now because of all the work he's already poured into it. Like I said, it's just human nature.

After reading your first few sentences I had planned on responding with a simple "MCV Vera". But I went on to find that you'd already beat me to it. I think the reason most Vera users still use Vera is because they 1) already spent money on it, 2) have sunk ridiculous amounts of time into it just to make it have some borderline conditional logic and 3) there are a plethora of really slick mobile remote controls for it that people really like. I was one of those people and I have never looked back. But as has been pointed out on the board quite a bit recently I use HomeSeer and HS3 isn't aimed at the average guy who just wants to turn his lights on and off from his iphone. Vera is.

[Thrag]

While my knowledge of the current state of smart things is out of date, it seems like a home remote control system rather than a home automation system

[randy]

Saw a post on Facebook about SmartThings under Z-Wave, which lead to a SmartThings vs Homeseer post.
https://community.smartthings.com/t/...homeseer/10715

A lot of Homeseer bashing going on there.

The Homeseer peeps might want to get some posts on the Z-Wave Home Automation FaceBook Group to get Homeseer out there too.

A thread with 12 posts from February, with 3 people saying they are unhappy with HomeSeer, one wishing SmartThings would connect to HomeSeer, one that HomeSeer does audio/video better and one that is unhappy SmartThings dies without Internet access, hardly deserves any attention.

I do agree that if you are happy with HomeSeer to make it known.

[mrhappy]

A thread with 12 posts from February, with 3 people saying they are unhappy with HomeSeer, one wishing SmartThings would connect to HomeSeer, one that HomeSeer does audio/video better and one that is unhappy SmartThings dies without Internet access, hardly deserves any attention.

I do agree that if you are happy with HomeSeer to make it known.

I think that a high degree of unhappiness with HS is from people who know what HS could be with enough time dedicated to it, myself included.

I imagine that trying to deal with a customer base of people which include software developers and people with above average knowledge of IT stuff must be a nightmare because they know how capable the software could be and know how easy some bugs could be to fix. With the all in one smart hub type products you might be dealing with users who are a little more in the dark about how things work and of course probably have ten times as much money behind them which no doubt helps.