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Using Z-Wave Switches to Control LED bulbs

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    Using Z-Wave Switches to Control LED bulbs

    I'm having some issues turning on LED bulbs with Z-Wave switches. There appears to be a load minimum that the LEDs easily go under, and the switch won't stay on. It will either go back off next to immediately or the bulb will flash.

    I do have a lot of LED bulbs on switches that work.

    I hit one situation where I was adding lower wattage LED bulbs to a circuit. I had 6 bulbs and 5 replaced fine. The 6th bulb, when unplugged, caused the switch to go off after about half a second. When I added the 6th bulb, I got a constant on/off pulsing (not the effect I was going for - was temporarily swapping in purple bulbs for white ones). I "fixed" the problem by putting a 25W incandescent into the 6th socket, but didn't get the all purple that I was going for. I did try swapping in a purple fluorescent, of higher wattage than the LED, but it just caused the pulsing, too.

    Specifically, I have GE/Iris switches since I didn't have access to the common wire without getting an electrician to make some modifications. The bulbs I'm switching in are LIFX, and they are only slightly lower in wattage than the bulbs I'm using. Four of the switches are one bulb/switch. I can't get these to work at all. One switch has 3 bulbs, and I can't replace all three. I can replace two, which I have, but if I try to do too much with color or dimming, they, too, to out.

    I could do a lot of experimenting, but don't currently have the time and don't want to go to extra expense unless I know a solution will work. Any help?

    David

    #2
    The Fibaro dimmers have a bypass unit that you have to fit with led bulbs.
    However a relay shouldn't matter.

    I have found different bulbs act differently too, that was trial and error.


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      #3
      Yes, I'm finding different bulbs and switches act differently, even with non-Z-Wave switches. When I started all of this, I was converting to LED bulbs. I had to go through several different (dimmer) switches and sets of bulbs before I got things working. My problem right now is that I don't have the time to experiment, and Z-Wave switches cost a lot more than regular switches.

      My main concern here is getting the LIFX bulbs working. I have four up and running. They currently are NOT on a Z-Wave switch, though I may want/need to add a Z-Wave module in the future as these lights are also not on a manual switch. I am controlling them with the UltraLighting3 plugin. This was also "new" installation, so I could set them up from what I now know.

      I like these LIFX bulbs so much that I want to retrofit the rest of the spots I have. These spots are "old" installation and thus on Z-Wave switches.

      If there is something to add to the circuitry, I can do that. If I need to use different Z-Wave switches and get the wiring updated so that I have access to the common wire, I can do that. I just need a solution that someone else knows works.

      David

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        #4
        The Fibaro dimmer bypass sounds like it would fix the problem. So the question is, will this work with other Z-Wave switches? It's also cost effective if it works.

        Then the issue becomes where to install it. I think on the four individual bulb/switches I have exposed wire I could do this on. On the 3-bulb circuit, I'd need to install it closer to the switch, and I don't think there is room in the switch box, though I don't know how small these are.

        David

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          #5
          And just thought of something......I don't have access to the common at the switch box anyway.......

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            #6
            They are installed at any light on the circuit over the load.
            I don't know if they work on other switches though.


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              #7
              I bought one of the Fibaro bypass units. I can only find version 2 of this device, which might make a difference. Fibaro support will not, of course, claim to work with anything except Fibaro devices.

              I had mixed success, and still need to do some more experimenting. I tried the device out on one of the one bulb circuits, which would not come on at all. Through some coaxing, I was able to get the light come on. I got part way through pairing it, but because the light flashes during programming, it would go off. So, this device isn't enough to allow the bulbs to be anything but full on. Even at that point, getting the switch to turn on and stay on took some doing. In other words, this isn't a good resolution.

              I need to try it on my three bulb circuit. There might be enough additional load there to make things work.

              So.....does anyone know if there is a vendor who still carriers the original bypass units? I don't know if they are any better, but would be worth trying.

              And....would having a switch that has the common wired fix this situation? I need a definite answer, not an I think so answer. To swap out the switch would take quite a bit more effort and would involve me needing to track down an electrician. If I go to all that cost and effort and it doesn't work, I'm out a lot of time and money.

              David

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                #8
                I have only used the bypass with Fibaro relays.
                Works even with a single 4w Led bulb.
                I do know the version 1 and 2 bypasses only work with the matching relay.
                I don't have a neutral at the relay.
                What I did do was change the frequency on one circuit to stop flickering.


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                  #9
                  http://store.zwavecenter.com/index.p...product_id=293

                  try this

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                    #10
                    How do these 'dimmer bypass' products work technically? Do they present a permanent minimum load? If so, wouldn't this imply the circuit is always drawing power even when the Z-Wave switch is off which means the circuit is constantly wasting power?

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                      #11
                      I'll stick a multimeter in and see.
                      I think it will apply a permanent load.


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                        #12
                        Here's an update on what I've tried.....

                        I bought a Fibaro bypass, series 2, as the series 1 can't be found. I wired it in parallel with one of the bulbs. I was able to get THREE bulbs up and going, but alas, could not turn them on and off. They all lost their connection after a couple tries and reset.

                        So, I went back to TWO bulbs, and it looked like things were stable. But, they weren't. The circuit would go off out unexpectedly. So I put both of the original LED bulbs, that were working fine, back in. Again, looked stable, but again, the lights went off unexpectedly. This is not good. This application is at a church, and the three lights light up the altar and cross.

                        Saturday I will have someone pull the bypass back out, and hopefully I'll be back to stable. I would do it myself, but have developed an ear infection and it affects my balance, and I don't trust myself on a ladder.

                        In the mean time, I found some generic bypass units that look similar to the ones you link to, but I found them on Ebay. I have one in hand, and when I get to feeling better will start to experiment again.

                        One question, though.....this is on a dimmer, but it really doesn't need to be a dimmer, since I can control the light dimming through the bulbs. Would the problem go away if I went to a straight Z-Wave load switch? Would I need the common?

                        David

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                          #13
                          This is a follow up in case anyone else has this issue.

                          I tried the generic bypass unit and it worked better than the Fibaro unit, but still would not allow me to use three bulbs. However, it was stable with two bulbs, which the Fibaro was NOT. I ordered more units, which took forever to get here. I added one at a time, tried serial and parallel, and after adding four units in parallel (two on one light, one on each of the others) I was able to get all three bulbs on and programmed, but I still lost them when I turned them off and back on (not quickly.....I know the LIFX bulbs react to quick on/off).

                          I was running out of time, so I switched to plan B. I have one manual switch in the bank, so I traded it with the Z-Wave switch. That did the trick, though now the lights have to be turned on/off manually (yes, I could program them, but my goal is to always be able to control things manually as a back up).

                          I don't know if the bypass units are needed with the manual switch. When I gets some time, that is probably what I'll test first. Then I'll test using a Z-Wave switch instead of dimmer, IF I can find one that doesn't need the common. If I have to use the common, I'll try a dimmer again. I'll try to remember to post back with the results.

                          David

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