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    ZNet G3 and routes

    I've seen some people using the PC Controller to set routes.... but I'll be damned if i can figure it out.

    On the old ZnetG2 - I had custom routes set up for several devices.... my network was rock solid - I could test any node and have zero (or nearly zero) packet loss. I upgraded to the ZNet G3 and it's been nothing but trouble. One of my door locks constantly stops "talking" - and there appears to be no way to set routes to optimize the connection.

    I'm running the latest Beta ZWave version, which claims to support routes in ZSeer.... but... it doesn't. When I go to manually specify the routes, the only options are "Auto"... Meanwhile, my front door lock - which is adjacent to other devices that work just fine, fails 99% of the time on the return route.

    What gives? How can I force a route that works? The device itself certainly isn't figuring it out.

    Thanks in advance!

    #2
    I believe HST stated that the 700 series SDK no longer supports manually setting a route. They did say that clearing routing information could be supported, but manually set routing is not. The V4 plug-in is using the new SDK, I think.

    You could take a full backup of your system, roll back to 3.0.11.0 and set the routing for devices, shut down HS and restore from your backup. This will allow you to set routing (all stored in the interface) and revert to the V4 plug-in.
    HS4 Pro, 4.2.19.0 Windows 10 pro, Supermicro LP Xeon

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      #3
      Originally posted by randy View Post
      I believe HST stated that the 700 series SDK no longer supports manually setting a route. They did say that clearing routing information could be supported, but manually set routing is not. The V4 plug-in is using the new SDK, I think.

      You could take a full backup of your system, roll back to 3.0.11.0 and set the routing for devices, shut down HS and restore from your backup. This will allow you to set routing (all stored in the interface) and revert to the V4 plug-in.
      Well... I honestly noticed that performance was crap just by upgrading to the ZNET G3, so I would assume it wasn't playing nice with my manually configured routes. I had a few devices that became "unreachable" after swapping to the G3 ZNET. I was all prepared to remove devices and re-add them to clear it up, but I decided instead today to try a "Full Optimize" (Something I avoided like the plague on the G2 ZNET) because I figured it couldnt hurt anything...

      Well.. after a little over an hour once all devices were optimized - everything is back online and very responsive. I wonder if the 700 series chips simply do a better job of optimization than the prior generation in the G2 Znets. Back then, my manually defined routes were ALWAYS better than what was "uncovered" by a full optimize - but so far (knock on wood) - this seems to be pretty solid on the G3.

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        #4
        Originally posted by Deniolan View Post
        Well.. after a little over an hour once all devices were optimized - everything is back online and very responsive. I wonder if the 700 series chips simply do a better job of optimization than the prior generation in the G2 Znets. Back then, my manually defined routes were ALWAYS better than what was "uncovered" by a full optimize - but so far (knock on wood) - this seems to be pretty solid on the G3.
        I don’t know the answer, but I do believe technology should do a better job of routing than we do. If it took into consideration signal strength of and number of hops to a device, it should be able to make good decisions. Certainly if it clears the route then optimizes, it would do the same as a manual optimization except for picking the order in which they are done.

        Since replacing a controller, clears routing information, I would expect the performance to suffer. With Z-Wave plus devices, they will begin to heal, but it takes use. A network wide optimization could really force it quicker.
        HS4 Pro, 4.2.19.0 Windows 10 pro, Supermicro LP Xeon

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          #5
          Originally posted by randy View Post
          I don’t know the answer, but I do believe technology should do a better job of routing than we do. If it took into consideration signal strength of and number of hops to a device, it should be able to make good decisions. Certainly if it clears the route then optimizes, it would do the same as a manual optimization except for picking the order in which they are done.
          Don't disagree. I can only speak to my experience. Optimize via the ZNETG2 in my network yielded less optimized routes than manual tuning. Its almost like it went purely on signal strength. After an optimize I could look at routes with ZSeer and see devices taking two to three hops where they really only needed one, and in some cases none. My response times and device tests were always more solid and responsive with manually defined routes based purely on proximity with the G2 ZNet. Sometimes it would pick a really strong node to hop to when the destination node was quite strong itself. It's a pointless hop.

          Originally posted by randy View Post
          Since replacing a controller, clears routing information, I would expect the performance to suffer. With Z-Wave plus devices, they will begin to heal, but it takes use. A network wide optimization could really force it quicker.
          Are you sure about that? I would specifically think return routes are stored in the node. Outgoing routes, that makes sense. Prior to doing this optimize, it seemed to be the return path that was tripping up a few of my devices, not the outgoing path from the controller to the node.

          Coincidentally.... in your initial post you said that the SDK no longer supports manually setting a route. I wonder if this is actually a homeseer issue (just not implemented yet) rather than a SDK issue. In PC Controller there are specific functions for defining routes. Further, when you do an optimize, you see homeseer saying that it's setting the return route. Additionally, the latest version of ZSeer has an update that is claimed to make routes visible (but, in my case anyways, it doesn't work - although I have not tried it again since today's optimize - I'll have to give it a shot and see what it says now).

          Cheers!

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            #6
            Originally posted by Deniolan View Post
            Additionally, the latest version of ZSeer has an update that is claimed to make routes visible (but, in my case anyways, it doesn't work - although I have not tried it again since today's optimize - I'll have to give it a shot and see what it says now).
            Just tried it... ZSeer still doesnt show routes... so I have no idea what the latest ZWave Beta update actually accomplished

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              #7
              Originally posted by Deniolan View Post

              Don't disagree. I can only speak to my experience. Optimize via the ZNETG2 in my network yielded less optimized routes than manual tuning. Its almost like it went purely on signal strength. After an optimize I could look at routes with ZSeer and see devices taking two to three hops where they really only needed one, and in some cases none. My response times and device tests were always more solid and responsive with manually defined routes based purely on proximity with the G2 ZNet. Sometimes it would pick a really strong node to hop to when the destination node was quite strong itself. It's a pointless hop.



              Are you sure about that? I would specifically think return routes are stored in the node. Outgoing routes, that makes sense. Prior to doing this optimize, it seemed to be the return path that was tripping up a few of my devices, not the outgoing path from the controller to the node.
              I’m not sure, but HomeSeer has stated routing is stored in the controller and is not contained in the backups. Yes this is outbound routing. For return routing it is stored in a limited fashion within the node. I have circumstantial evidence in that every time I have replaced a controller, the routing is gone. You could see it with the V3 plug-ins. You can feel it with the V4 plug-in. Understand that since I do a lot of experimenting, I’ve swapped quite a few. Last year I swapped all my Z-Nets to have the new 700 series controller. That was 6 devices. All of them were swapped under 3.0.11.0 and all routing was gone.This old simple image shows that all routing is stored in node 1 (controller).

              Click image for larger version  Name:	image.png Views:	0 Size:	284.3 KB ID:	1601195

              Coincidentally.... in your initial post you said that the SDK no longer supports manually setting a route. I wonder if this is actually a homeseer issue (just not implemented yet) rather than a SDK issue. In PC Controller there are specific functions for defining routes. Further, when you do an optimize, you see homeseer saying that it's setting the return route. Additionally, the latest version of ZSeer has an update that is claimed to make routes visible (but, in my case anyways, it doesn't work - although I have not tried it again since today's optimize - I'll have to give it a shot and see what it says now).

              Cheers!
              Rich wrote that the SDK no longer supports assigning a route manually. He thinks there is still a mechanism to clear routing. Honestly, that is usually the only thing I did. When I find that a node has generated a circuitous rout through a page number of nodes, when it is only 10 feet from the controller, that is when I would clear it. Then it came back with a direct path. I occasionally had luck setting a route, but it would usually be overwritten when the controller made new decisions.
              HS4 Pro, 4.2.19.0 Windows 10 pro, Supermicro LP Xeon

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