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Conditions - The Group Conditions Are

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    Conditions - The Group Conditions Are

    This is a powerful tool that will allow you to create a condition or several conditions that can be applied to events within a specific group.







    The group conditions can be selectively be applied to events within a group. The group conditions are not automatically applied to events within a group, but you can selectively add a condition to any or every event within the group. You MUST add the Group Conditions Condition to EVERY event in which you want to evaluate the Group Conditions. The condition can evaluate whether the group conditions are ALL true or ALL false. Remember it is all or none, if there are three conditions with two true and one false, the Group Conditions Condition will always be false and the event will not run.

    Add the condition to an event, then click on the orange triangle to expand the group conditions option.







    After you have expanded the Group Options section you can add the conditions you want to selectively apply to events within this group. You will notice it says "(Choose a Trigger or Condition)", this is a misstatement, your only choice will be among conditions. Using a trigger as a condition would in almost every case cause an event to fail. You will notice that the choices and the values within the choices are the same as event conditions. Each group you define within your events can have different group conditions and each event within a group can have the conditions selectively evaluated and applied. Obviously if there is only one condition, it would make more sense to put it individually within the event, but if there are two or more conditions that may apply to several or all events within the group, group conditions may save you some time when creating or remove clutter from your events. Another advantage is that you can make a change to the group conditions and affect a large number of events.







    Below is an event that could be used within a motion control event group where we want to only run the event if it is a weekday and is during the period of nighttime. You could build a number of events within this group and make a decision as to whether these group conditions would apply on an event by event basis. Below is the event expanded.







    Here is the event and group collapsed to show you concisely what will happen. Also note that you could make the event condition based upon the group conditions all being FALSE making the event only run if there was motion in the daytime and on a weekend (NOT Weekday and NOT Nighttime).








    If there are group conditions to be applied to events and the Group Conditions option is collapsed, there will be a green check mark to remind you that there are conditions defined.







    If you have created Group Conditions, but they are not applied to any events within that group, you will get a waning triangle. As is the case of most icons on the event management page, if you hover over the triangle you will get a tool tip explaining the meaning.



    Last edited by randy; January 18, 2016, 07:53 PM.

    #2
    I'm trying to create "wintertime" group conditions: before 4/15/YYYY OR after 10/15/YYYY. I can't add OR IF to the group conditions! How do I create these group conditions?

    Steve Q


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
    HomeSeer Version: HS3 Pro Edition 3.0.0.368, Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 - Home, Number of Devices: 373, Number of Events: 666, Enabled Plug-Ins
    2.0.83.0: BLRF, 2.0.10.0: BLUSBUIRT, 3.0.0.75: HSTouch Server, 3.0.0.58: mcsXap, 3.0.0.11: NetCAM, 3.0.0.36: X10, 3.0.1.25: Z-Wave,Alexa,HomeKit

    Comment


      #3
      You don't need an OR. Just make two conditions:

      If the date is after 10/15/YYYY

      AND IF the date is before 4/15/YYYY
      Originally posted by rprade
      There is no rhyme or reason to the anarchy a defective Z-Wave device can cause

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by S-F View Post
        You don't need an OR. Just make two conditions:

        If the date is after 10/15/YYYY

        AND IF the date is before 4/15/YYYY
        That won't work because midnight on December 31 is to a year as midnight is to a day.

        When you say IF the date is after 10/15/YYYY it is effectively saying IF the date is after 10/15/YYYY and before 12/31/YYYY and when you say AND IF the date is before 4/15/YYYY it is effectively saying the date is after 12/31/YYYY and before 4/15/YYYY. Both can never be true so the event wouldn't run.

        It is not a candidate for group conditions. You will either have to construct each event with multiple triggers and conditions, or (my preference) create a virtual device called "wintertime" then two events:

        Event 1
        IF the time is 12:00 AM
        AND IF the date is after 10/15/YYYY

        OR IF the time is 12:00 AM
        AND IF the date is before 4/15/YYYY

        THEN Set device Winteritime ot OM


        Event 2
        IF the time is 12:00 AM
        AND IF the date is after 4/15/YYYY
        AND IF the date is before 10/15/YYYY

        THEN Set device Winteritime to OFF


        Then use the virtual device in your events such as


        IF the time is 8:00 PM
        AND IF The Device Wintertime is equal to ON
        THEN set device Porch Light to ON
        Last edited by randy; January 18, 2016, 07:55 PM.

        Comment


          #5
          If I'm understanding group conditions correctly, then (I have yet to use them), it's basically a way to "bookmark" a bunch of conditions that will likely be applied to at least a couple of events in a group -- so you don't have to re-enter the conditions in each event of the group?

          Is this correct, or is there added functionality beyond this?

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by rprade View Post
            That won't work because midnight on December 31 is to a year as midnight is to a day.

            When you say IF the date is after 10/15/YYYY it is effectively saying IF the date is after 10/15/YYYY and before 12/31/YYYY and when you say AND IF the date is before 4/15/YYYY it is effectively saying the date is after 12/31/YYYY and before 4/15/YYYY. Both can never be true so the event wouldn't run.

            It is not a candidate for group conditions. You will either have to construct each event with multiple triggers and conditions, or (my preference) create a virtual device called "wintertime" then two events:

            Event 1
            IF the time is 12:00 AM
            AND IF the date is after 10/15/YYYY

            OR IF the time is 12:00 AM
            AND IF the date is before 4/15/YYYY

            THEN Set device Winteritime ot OM


            I]Event 2 [/I]
            IF the time is 12:00 AM
            AND IF the date is after 4/15/YYYY
            AND IF the date is before 10/15/YYYY

            THEN Set device Winteritime to OFF


            Then use the virtual device in your events such as


            IF the time is 8:00 PM
            AND IF The Device Wintertime is equal to ON
            THEN set device Porch Light to ON
            Yes, I know I could do it this way, but I was trying to use group conditions. You say "It is not a candidate for group conditions." ; so it's a bug?

            Steve Q
            HomeSeer Version: HS3 Pro Edition 3.0.0.368, Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 - Home, Number of Devices: 373, Number of Events: 666, Enabled Plug-Ins
            2.0.83.0: BLRF, 2.0.10.0: BLUSBUIRT, 3.0.0.75: HSTouch Server, 3.0.0.58: mcsXap, 3.0.0.11: NetCAM, 3.0.0.36: X10, 3.0.1.25: Z-Wave,Alexa,HomeKit

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by mikedr View Post
              If I'm understanding group conditions correctly, then (I have yet to use them), it's basically a way to "bookmark" a bunch of conditions that will likely be applied to at least a couple of events in a group -- so you don't have to re-enter the conditions in each event of the group?

              Is this correct, or is there added functionality beyond this?
              That is the purpose, to be able to use a group of specific conditions to be shared among several events within a group.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Steve Q View Post
                Yes, I know I could do it this way, but I was trying to use group conditions. You say "It is not a candidate for group conditions." ; so it's a bug?

                Steve Q
                It is not a bug. Group conditions are only conditions and cannot contain triggers. In order to cross the line at midnight or at the end of a year you must use multiple trigger/condition sets. It is necessary to draw a line at midnight just as it is at the end of a year. Otherwise 4/14/YYYY would be both before AND after 4/15/YYYY.

                It would be nice if we had a condition for "between" as a comparison for times and dates, but that condition does not exist. That would be an enhancement request which still can be filed in Bugzilla, but it is not a bug.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Homeseer knows how to handle dates that extend beyond the year end. The HS3 event below with group conditions works fine.

                  In HS2, For my Christmas lighting, I have been using the event conditions: Date is after 11/30/Y OR Date is before 1/10/Y for several years (see HS2 event below).

                  I expected the group conditions in HS3 to do the same.
                  Attached Files
                  Last edited by Steve Q; March 13, 2015, 12:19 PM.
                  HomeSeer Version: HS3 Pro Edition 3.0.0.368, Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 - Home, Number of Devices: 373, Number of Events: 666, Enabled Plug-Ins
                  2.0.83.0: BLRF, 2.0.10.0: BLUSBUIRT, 3.0.0.75: HSTouch Server, 3.0.0.58: mcsXap, 3.0.0.11: NetCAM, 3.0.0.36: X10, 3.0.1.25: Z-Wave,Alexa,HomeKit

                  Comment


                    #10
                    That is good. Either Group Conditions behave differently than regular conditions, or HS changed the behavior since it was confirmed not to work last year. I'll have to do some testing to correct my understanding of the conditions.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by rprade View Post
                      That won't work because midnight on December 31 is to a year as midnight is to a day.

                      Yep. Had a stupid moment here.
                      Originally posted by rprade
                      There is no rhyme or reason to the anarchy a defective Z-Wave device can cause

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Steve Q View Post
                        Homeseer knows how to handle dates that extend beyond the year end. The HS3 event below with group conditions works fine.

                        In HS2, For my Christmas lighting, I have been using the event conditions: Date is after 11/30/Y OR Date is before 1/10/Y for several years (see HS2 event below).

                        I expected the group conditions in HS3 to do the same.
                        I see you edited your original post to include references to HS2, but you still say it works in HS3 as well.


                        Well, I'll have to say color me confused. I don't see how the group conditions are working for you. I just created three events and have copied screenshots below. All three are set to trigger once a minute and to writhe a trace loge entry as to which event ran. I let them run for 10 minutes and below are the log entries.

                        Mar-13 12:00:04 PM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:59:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:58:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:57:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:56:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:55:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:54:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:53:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:52:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:51:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran
                        Mar-13 11:50:04 AM Trace Time span test - multi trigger ran

                        The log entries clearly show that the event will not run when
                        IF the date is after 10/15/Y
                        AND IF the date is Before 4/15/Y

                        are used as conditions -or- group conditions, only when used with additional triggers within an event.

                        I am at a loss as to how it works for you.
                        Attached Files

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by S-F View Post
                          Yep. Had a stupid moment here.
                          That's OK. As a friend told me, when I passed 60, it is really great being able to hide your own Easter eggs. Welcome to my world

                          Nevertheless, you know I live and breathe events, so this thread has forced me to go back and confirm behavior of the Event Engine - not a bad thing.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Yeah well, I'm 36 It's probably going to be pretty bad when I reach (IF I reach!) 60.
                            Originally posted by rprade
                            There is no rhyme or reason to the anarchy a defective Z-Wave device can cause

                            Comment


                              #15
                              The HS3 event group conditions I used contained the actual date not Y. (4/15/2015 not 4/15/Y).

                              Y only works in HS2, not HS3.

                              Steve Q
                              HomeSeer Version: HS3 Pro Edition 3.0.0.368, Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 - Home, Number of Devices: 373, Number of Events: 666, Enabled Plug-Ins
                              2.0.83.0: BLRF, 2.0.10.0: BLUSBUIRT, 3.0.0.75: HSTouch Server, 3.0.0.58: mcsXap, 3.0.0.11: NetCAM, 3.0.0.36: X10, 3.0.1.25: Z-Wave,Alexa,HomeKit

                              Comment

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