The Time Has Come

[SmartyPants]

This will probably get removed but I'll dump it here anyway.

I have, over the last year or so, found myself more and more disheartened with Homeseer. When I upgraded to HS4, I had nothing but problems, and while I expect some gremlins with new software, I couldn't really see what benefit there was to HS4 over HS3 other than a few minor things.

I went back to HS3 and left my system running, as usual, in it's very reliable state.
I've have spent many days creating dashboards with Jon00's HSTiles and think that was great compared with having to learn the expensive designer software, which sadly I bought and never used.

But here's the thing. So many things I wanted to do with HS I couldn't, because either there wasn't a plugin or I'm not a expert in scripting.
For my heating system integration I had to move to Domoticz and then integrate that with HS. Many other things I gave up on including my cctv integration (motion alerts).

But recently I came across a builtin addon for Home Assistant which created motion sensor devices for my cameras. I just added 4 short lines of code in the HA configuration file and HA auto created motion sensors from the cctv streams. Happy days.

It was while testing Home Assistant that I realised just how modern and advanced it was. Even HS4 didn't have anywhere near this level of options and usability.

Since delving into HA, I've found that I can integrate my heating system too and all the things I wanted to do with HS but couldn't, are just a click or two away.

One of the real big bonuses though is their dashboards which are so easy to configure and ready to go out the box. A little basic perhaps, but loads of potential.

SurprisIng me more was their app. I thought it would be just a few buttons to control stuff, but no, you have the whole HA interface at your disposal, all laid out in a simple, easy to use way. You can even pull up your ssh shell to configure stuff that way if you prefer, and it's so well laid out to use.

I tried tonight to include some zwave devices. The process was easy and for some reason quicker than Homeseer. One of the best parts about zwave configuration is that all the parameters for the device are listed with a description and drop down boxes to select what values you want. Changes occur instantly. A million times quicker than Homeseer.

I could go on. But It'll only get removed, so I'm here to say that if you are fed up of your current automation software, take a look at home assistant. After 2-3 hours I'm blown away by it and after testing the zwave devices a bit more, I'm moving my whole installation over to it gradually.

In my honest opinion, the only thing HST have right now, are very loyal customers. Their software is so far behind it's painful to see.

With that said, HS3 for me was the jewel in the crown. It was exceptionally reliable and HST zwave integration is probably one of the better ones... but that ain't enough.

I will say thanks to Jon00's while I'm at it, I used loads of his software to make HS do what it should do out of the box. I spent countless hours working with his HSTiles, and I hope you all continue to appreciate his free work.

[racerfern]

I will say thanks to jon00 while I'm at it, I used loads of his software to make HS do what it should do out of the box. I spent countless hours working with his HSTiles, and I hope you all continue to appreciate his free work.

Jon00's work isn't free. If you choose not to contribute, then it may be free to you, but it's probably costing Jon00 a small fortune.



As far as the first part of your post, I tried HA as well. It might be due to my scripting limitations, it might be due to the fact that most of the things I tried in HA assumed you knew your way around HA, Linux, etc. I will say kudos to their discovery process that found nearly all the diverse units in my house.

But after that I fell flat on my face. Their support forums also assume you know HA, Linux and scripting. I tried three times to get my Solaredge optimizer sensors to be seen within HACS. It took me two hours to get HACS installed, never did get it working properly. Try reading the instructions as if you're a newbie to all of it. USELESS!

HS removes a huge portion of the difficult behind the scenes part and makes it a lot easier to incorporate lots of stuff. Sure it has shortcomings, but it beats the heck out of the alternatives especially for the non-technical ones.

[concordseer]

This conversation has been done to death. We are all acutely aware of the wonders of Home Assistant and as the title of your post states, the time has come now off you jog. Just wait for a big Python upgrade though. That’s when the real fun will start for you. See who’s smiling then.

[mbdirtfarmer]

Good Luck. Hope it all works out for you.

[jgreenberg01]

Hey, HomeSeer isn't for everyone.

I hope the grass is greener on the HA side for you and not just a different shade of brown. Best of luck to you!

[donstephens]

Hey, HomeSeer isn't for everyone.

I hope the grass is greener on the HA side for you and not just a different shade of brown. Best of luck to you!

Well said, and seconded.

[SmartyPants]

Jon00's work isn't free. If you choose not to contribute, then it may be free to you, but it's probably costing Jon00 a small fortune.



As far as the first part of your post, I tried HA as well. It might be due to my scripting limitations, it might be due to the fact that most of the things I tried in HA assumed you knew your way around HA, Linux, etc. I will say kudos to their discovery process that found nearly all the diverse units in my house.

But after that I fell flat on my face. Their support forums also assume you know HA, Linux and scripting. I tried three times to get my Solaredge optimizer sensors to be seen within HACS. It took me two hours to get HACS installed, never did get it working properly. Try reading the instructions as if you're a newbie to all of it. USELESS!

HS removes a huge portion of the difficult behind the scenes part and makes it a lot easier to incorporate lots of stuff. Sure it has shortcomings, but it beats the heck out of the alternatives especially for the non-technical ones.

Jons works may not be free to him, but it is free to everyone irrespective. If they choose not to contribute, well that's up to them. I contributed small amounts where I could, but his time and support is worth much more than he'll ever get back. Homeseer has cost me plenty in plugins just to do basic stuff. I wonder to myself just how useful Homeseer would be if it wasn't for the plugin devs.

Scripting!
The scripts I've needed to write for Homeseer to do basic energy management and other stuff is laughable. I fumbled my way around stealing bits of scripts from other people and spending countless hours wasting my time on simple syntax errors because I don't know how to script properly. Even with certain tools available like tenscripting, it isn't always perfect. All my energy logging was done in 20 minutes with HA once I added the zwave meter, and all the graphing and data is natively available without any more work, it took me weeks to get it done with Homeseer and even then was extremely basic.


The biggest problem I had with home assistant so far was not actually HA based. It was getting the vm that hosts it to pass one of two identical zwave USB controllers to the HA guest system. If it passed both my HS3 system lost it's zwave controller. That's my only grumble, having to run HA as a vm, because it did add slightly to the complexity, but the guides were quick and easy to get it running, bar the USB issue, which wouldn't be the case normally.

In terms of automation, Homeseer is great. I've enjoyed my time with it, in fact, I may end up back with it. I've still got much of my network to move over, but there is so much I won't miss. I guess if simplicity is what you need, then great. But if you need more than that, perhaps it's not. There will always be die hard fans of any software, but If you've reached the limits then it's simply a case of move on or stop.

[SmartyPants]

This conversation has been done to death. We are all acutely aware of the wonders of Home Assistant and as the title of your post states, the time has come now off you jog. Just wait for a big Python upgrade though. That’s when the real fun will start for you. See who’s smiling then.

A bit like when I waited a year before upgrading to HS4, because by then it would be plenty stable, right?

Well it started fine but then over weeks slowly my network went downhill. My virtual devices developed parkinson's disease, my simple events weren't reliable anymore and trying to fix anything made things worse. I gave it 6 months on HS4 and at the end, after restoring from backups only to find the same thing happening again, I gave up and went back to HS3.

So having my network destroyed by upgrades is part of the journey for any software unfortunately. Maybe HS4 is finally ready for production, but for me I would sooner 'jog on'.

[SmartyPants]

Good Luck. Hope it all works out for you.

Thanks.

[SmartyPants]

Hey, HomeSeer isn't for everyone.

I hope the grass is greener on the HA side for you and not just a different shade of brown. Best of luck to you!

Thanks.

Homeseer was for me, maybe still is, if I can't find some reliability with HA then I'll dump it. I do avoid updates where possible for that reason.

I'm not unrealistic about it. There will be a whole new painful learning curve with HA. Hopefully my thorough backup routines will save my ***, just like it did with Homeseer numerous times.

[happnatious1]

I'm on my 3rd try getting Home Assistant to run on a ESXI virtual machine. The problem is there is no way to shut it down gracefully to take a snapshot. Googling yields different results probably based on what version you are running but the host shutdown command I did find literally crashes my ESXI host with a pink screen of death. Since HA runs in a container the Host shut down command should shutdown the underlying Debian OS (I think it's Debian) but that doesn't seem to be the case. I have little faith in programmers that cant get a simple shutdown command to work. I wish you better luck than I've had.

[SmartyPants]

I'm on my 3rd try getting Home Assistant to run on a ESXI virtual machine. The problem is there is no way to shut it down gracefully to take a snapshot. Googling yields different results probably based on what version you are running but the host shutdown command I did find literally crashes my ESXI host with a pink screen of death. Since HA runs in a container the Host shut down command should shutdown the underlying Debian OS (I think it's Debian) but that doesn't seem to be the case. I have little faith in programmers that cant get a simple shutdown command to work. I wish you better luck than I've had.

I've had a strange one the other day.
As you say, host shutdown should technically shutdown the underlying system in the VM, and it usually does.
Oddly, one time, it shutdown my physical Windows 10 server the VM runs from.
One thing that did cross my mind though, is that there are two different containers iirc, one is debian os with a home assistant installed and the other is HassOS or Hass IO I think they call it now, which they describe as the Home Assistant Operating System.

Cleary the latter is linux based too.
I'm just wondering if the host shutdown acts differently on both.
Just a thought.

Anyway, this isn't HA forum so I'll leave it there.

[ksum]

I tried HAss (HAss is the correct abbreviation for Home Assistant. HA = Home Automation) I found it cumbersome unless everything is in their OS which then means you have to wait for someone to approve an upgrade, such as Node-RED. Even inside their OS, some things became difficult. At least Raspberry Pis are coming back on the market for persons to load it on. Just watch your SD Card!

I have tried to support folks on the Node-RED use with HAss. The developers try to do WAY too much with HAss nodes as opposed to making them simple and letting you write the functionality. Add on top of that an over dependency on YAML (sure, they are changing that, but still) and a feeling that I need to write something for anything I do, and forget it.

Good luck to you. As for me, it came down to proving that you get what you pay for.

[randy]

I do not work for HomeSeer nor do I receive any remuneration of any kind from HST, I’m simply a user who supports this product.

I have no issue discussing HomeSeer’s shortcomings, nor with someone who finds it doesn’t suit them.

My brother was a very early adopter having started before HS1 was released. I got involved 10 years ago this December, installing a Beta of HS3. I never touched HS2. I immediately saw promise for my desired applications and dove in with both feet. We wanted to do power management, HVAC management, lighting, irrigation and security. This was the end of 2013. I dove in head first, learning the “language” of HS3. While others struggled, for whatever reason I understood almost immediately how HomeSeer worked. The methodology was new to me, but it was easily understood. By March of 2014 I posted this showing how I integrated energy management, temperature monitoring and Arduino interfaces. In December of 2014 I started building out the HS3 Event Clinic, with HomeSeer’s blessing. I’m now approaching 10 years of using the system and have over 1500 Events and over 4600 Devices. Day after day, week after week, HomeSeer is just running and doing its job. No drama, no worries.

For me HomeSeer has been very reliable. I know we discovered a bug in 2014 that caused HomeSeer to crash with a particular Event Condition, but since then there have been No HomeSeer failures. I lost an SSD a few years ago, but no HomeSeer failures. Over the years there have been bugs and annoyances, but absolutely no deal breakers.

Another user might find a competitor’s product will suit them better.

I love my BMWs (cars and motorcycles), they speak to me when driven. Others have an equally valid opinion that they are horrible. To each their own.

[kenm]

I ran HS3 and Home Assistant in parallel for almost 18 months and finally decided it wasn't for me. The rate of change in HA-core was too much to get any kind of stability so each release was a new adventure. Best of luck with your new system. Of course, we will be here if you decide to come back to HS.