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Great Plugin, deCONZ not so much? Back to Zwave for me.

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    Great Plugin, deCONZ not so much? Back to Zwave for me.

    I'm about a month into testing zigbee on HS4. Before we build our next house I needed to choose Zigbee vs Zwave for our main mesh network. My assessment so far is that Zigbee 3.0 is still hit and miss. I've had issues with frequency interference at 2.4GHz, I've had two out of 5 Zigbee 3.0 devices that inconsistently connect (an outlet and a bulb). I have to say that the philips hue devices and hub are rock solid, but that would be expected. I really like how reliable the jowihue plug in has been. But support for deCONZ seems to be non-existent - I've tried posting an issue on the deconz api github site with no response although I do see other device issues being addressed there. To me the value of Zwave is in the testing and validation of devices and consistency of the zwave mesh over time and the level of zwave device support by homeseer, this forum is far above what I see on deconz.

    So while my main (most devices) mesh is going to be zwave, I do see the future of getting zigbee up and running and expect I'll need to support both, with two independent meshes - definitely limiting my zigbee devices to those on the deconz 'supported' list (eventhough I've already done this and had problems).

    Just sharing my thoughts - all subject to change in a few years I'm sure

    #2
    I used to have the "all Z-wave" philosophy, but years of trials and failures have taught me valuable lessons:

    Z-wave dimmers for the most part are pretty rock solid across many different manufacturers. Being able to include event control into many models is also an added benefit and eliminates having separate scene controllers or wall tablets.

    Z-wave battery sensors (series 300 and 500 chips) are simply terrible. Most people resort to powering them from an external power supply... which defeats the purpose of having a battery sensor! (not having to run extra wires or have them showing). After doing some experimentation and desiring to have some color bulbs in my house, I've now built out a parallel zigbee mesh that utilizes Phillips Hue bulbs and cheap ($10) Ikea outlet control plugs as routers, all being controlled from the deconz USB controller. This has given me a zigbee network as solid as my mature Z-wave network, which in turn has allowed me to deploy low-cost, fast and small zigbee battery sensors everywhere. They are rock solid and perform better than any Z-wave ones I've ever encountered.

    So now I have the best of both worlds, Z-wave devices for load control and event/scene control, and zigbee battery sensors for telemetry and environmental data gathering.

    In both cases of Z-wave and Zigbee, if you don't design the network right then you will have disappointing results.

    Just my 2-cents.

    Comment


      #3
      Almost same here. Zihbee mesh is philips hue only. And I use several of cheap aqara door and motion sensors.

      The best I get with zigbee is the speed of the hue motion sensors. You can’t beat that unless the sensors is wired.

      I do not want to test other brand, there are too many issues on github....But it is hard to blame deconz, it seems to be brand specific problems.. and I think all devices are somewhat reverse engineered.

      Comment


        #4
        I simpatize...

        I don't like deconz at all. I use HUE with a HUE bridge, I fail to see a single advantage on buying a RPi plus a dongle to do what the HUE bridge can do by itself more reliably and actually can be a lot cheaper. For the rest of my Zigbees, I use Hubitat Elevation Hub with the Hubiat plugin which has great device support and is rock solid together with the plugin. Bear in mind I do have multiple RPis and I also have a Conbee2 so it's not like I didn't tried.

        Battery operated Zigbees are the best but not all are quality made since they tend to be more price than performance oriented. In my humble opinion, regardless of the RF technology, z-waves tend to be better made that their Zigbee siblings which at least for me is important.

        I bought some Aqara temperature sensors but at the end, almost all of my zigbee devices are either HUE (controlled by a HUE bridge) or Samsung (controlled by Hubitat) so I ended up using Aeotec's AërQ in non secure mode.

        It might be fair to say, I also use the Aeotec's series 7 repeaters which throws z-wave reliability through the roof. Don't ask me why having almost 20 Aeotec Smart Switch 6 all over my place is not as good as adding just two of these repeaters... I don't care why or how, they simply work.

        I do agree the HUE motion sensor is one of the best motion sensors you can find in the market regardless of being zigbee based or not. I use them combined with the Insteon's Motion Sensor II around my house for multiple applications. I find the insteon's better as presence sensors. I do have a couple of Aeotec's MultiSensor Motion detector or whatever the name is, the one with a lot of sensors, but somehow I like the previous two better.

        The bottom line for me is, since the Jowihue plugin supports HUE accessories connected to HUE bridge which is simply fantastic, something that is a lot less common that some may think, together with the use of Hubitat Elevation Hub/Plugin, renders deconz useless for me but Zigbees remains useful.

        Just a peek of some of the devices I've tested or in use:

        Click image for larger version

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        Actually I registered a deconz to jowihue and now I'm unable to get rid of the thing... but that is another subject.

        My 0.00000000000000000000002 cents folks!

        Have a great day!




        Comment


          #5
          not sure about the issues you guys are having but jowihue + deconz has been rock solid for me

          I am using smarthings buttons, smartthings water sensors, ikea plugs, and ikea buttons

          (I hated buying the 2450 batteries, so I wired the buttons to 2xAA rechargeables. A little ugly, but they work great)

          I did have a deconz issue with a gledopto zigbee 5v LED strip, but then I updated deconz and issue is totally gone

          I did noticed if you create an infinite loop of updating zigbee devices deconz/jowihue will crash, but that makes. Double check this isnt happening


          something I did point out in the forum, and hoping w.vuyk can help. My HS4 Jowihue plugin is using a 192.168.... ip address to connect to deconz. HS4 and deconz are on the same machine/ip. It is not using localhost 127.0.0.1

          ... so if you have network issues, HS4 jowihue is relying on the 192.168... IP address to still be workin. This could be the reason zigbee stuff fails for some people

          Comment


            #6
            Just to clarify my post. Deconz works flawless here for me. I am just afraid to use anything else then philips hue ''router'' for creating the mesh.


            Edit: Something nice would be to have a list of devices somewhere that works flawless since (let's say 6 months). Here or on deconz github.

            edit2: A little out of topic, but since there is a bunch a people using deconz, I think Dresden electronik should have a forum instead of a discord channel + GitHub issues). I might propose the idea on GitHub.

            Comment


              #7
              Would you mind to share some pictures? If you have the time,

              (I hated buying the 2450 batteries, so I wired the buttons to 2xAA rechargeables. A little ugly, but they work great)
              dev120v

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by dev120v View Post


                something I did point out in the forum, and hoping w.vuyk can help. My HS4 Jowihue plugin is using a 192.168.... ip address to connect to deconz. HS4 and deconz are on the same machine/ip. It is not using localhost 127.0.0.1

                ... so if you have network issues, HS4 jowihue is relying on the 192.168... IP address to still be workin. This could be the reason zigbee stuff fails for some people

                I totally agree on this. I did test one day ( after cloning my entire ssd) to replace 192.xxxx adress with 127.0.0.1 in the Jowihue PED device. It worked from what saw on the hs log, but i am not sure if the websocket was using 127.0.0.1.

                edit : I think enabling trace debug would have answered that question , but didn't think about this when I tested this ''hack''

                Comment


                  #9
                  This is what I used to change the ped attribute back to a 192.xxx adress, cuz I was note sure if it would cause issues somewhere else... . I do not totally remember what I did to changed it to 127.0.0.1 ( From memory I think I needed to deleted the PED entry and add it back with 127.0.0.1). I am not a developer at all. It was with trials/errors and with the help of hs3 documentation that I found how to do it.
                  + The base script was given from someone else ( for another purpose), so didn't start from scratch.

                  Code:
                  public int Main(Object[] args)
                  {
                  int dvRef = 5299;
                  
                  Scheduler.Classes.DeviceClass dv = (Scheduler.Classes.DeviceClass)hs.GetDeviceByRef(dvRef);
                  hs.WriteLog("info", dv.get_Name(null));
                  PlugExtraData.clsPlugExtraData EDO = dv.get_PlugExtraData_Get(hs);
                  
                  foreach(string name in EDO.GetNamedKeys())
                  {
                  hs.WriteLog("info", name);
                  }
                  
                  EDO.AddNamed("Ipaddress", "192.x.x.x:PORT");
                  
                  hs.SaveEventsDevices();
                  
                  return 0;
                  }

                  That said... I think Wim did something to the plugin to prevent an issue some user were having here. So I think the plugin now ignore loopback ip. So I would wait for Wim w.vuyk to test anything related to what I posted here.
                  Attached Files

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Also, jon00 devices viewer helped a lot for the visual cue
                    Attached Files

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by MattL0 View Post
                      Just to clarify my post. Deconz works flawless here for me. I am just afraid to use anything else then philips hue ''router'' for creating the mesh.


                      Edit: Something nice would be to have a list of devices somewhere that works flawless since (let's say 6 months). Here or on deconz github.

                      edit2: A little out of topic, but since there is a bunch a people using deconz, I think Dresden electronik should have a forum instead of a discord channel + GitHub issues). I might propose the idea on GitHub.
                      I use conbee 2, no problems. I do need to have the conbee 2 plugged into a usb extension cable though. If it is to close to my pi 4, it doesn't work well

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by MattL0 View Post
                        Would you mind to share some pictures? If you have the time,



                        dev120v
                        Photos attached

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by dev120v View Post

                          Photos attached
                          Ever consider just getting 2450 rechargeables?

                          https://www.amazon.com/dp/B082HQKN68/ref=emc_b_5_t

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by TC1 View Post

                            Ever consider just getting 2450 rechargeables?

                            https://www.amazon.com/dp/B082HQKN68/ref=emc_b_5_t
                            ya I did, but decided to use the 2xAA option. I am in Canada and small electronics have stupid markup/shipping to get here

                            I can hide the wires and AA battery pack easy where I am using them, so it just worked out

                            **edit**
                            they have some on amazon.ca now..lol oh well. I did it a long time ago and they have worked great
                            https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B08D8ZF57C/...C01C0DASPH3END

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Most of my automation devices are z-wave+, but more recently I have started playing with deCONZ/Conbee II. I have now completely retired my Phillips Hue square bridge and re-registered all of my Hue lamps and strips to the Conbee II. Additionally I had no trouble adding some Chinese triple zigbee switches (3 switches on 1 gang). Replacing the Hue Bridge with the Conbee II enabled the use of third party zigbee devices and I have to say it's been rock solid. I admit the eco-system is not as user friendly as with the Hue bridge, especially with the several different names (deCONZ / Conbee II / Phoscon App) you first need to learn to be able to use, but once you're past that, it's very reliable.

                              I second the need to use a USB extender cable to have the Conbee II away from the Raspberry Pi and other electronics.

                              Comment

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