Z-Wave forwarding

[mc2software]

I have 10 Kwikset Z-Wave keypad locks spread over 3 buildings (house,garage,guest house). I have them all registered in my HS4-Pi. However, the locks do not operate unless the HS4-Pi is in the same building as the lock. I thought that Z-Wave devices forward requests to devices that do not have a direct connection to the controller. Is this an issue with the locks or with HS4? Do I need to add additional controllers to each building in order to get access to all locks from any location?

[TC1]

If your locks are already properly registered with the controller (ie, you can lock/unlock, get status remotely) then the next step is that all the devices in the vicinity of the locks need to support the Z-wave Beaming specification. Z-wave beaming devices will store/que-up messages meant for battery-powered non-listening devices and be able to wake them up when needed.

Let's say you have a lock on a door, you more than likely have some wall switches/dimmers near the lock. All those devices should support Z-wave Beaming in order to maintain communication with the lock via multiple z-wave hops.

[mc2software]

The locks are registered and can lock/unlock when the HS4-Pi is in the building, but won't work on devices in other buildings. Wifi APs in each building.They're all no more than 30 ft. away from each other. So I'm thinking the locks don't support the beaming spec. I'll test an extender to see if that helps.

[TC1]

No, you have it wrong. The locks are battery powered and are designed to work with other Z-wave devices that support beaming, those other devices would be dimmers, wall plugs, etc. Has nothing to do with WiFi APs.

Do you have other Z-wave devices in those buildings that can communicate with the HS-Pi?
If so, are they near the locks?
If so, what is the make/model of those devices?

[mc2software]

The only Z-wave devices in the other buildings are the locks. All lights and light switches are wifi. I know that it's not related the the Wifi APs: I was just letting everyone know how I have the buildings configured for wifi.

The locks are Kwikset 916s.

For clarification, to help clarify the layout, the three buildings are the house, detached garage and guest house. As part of my testing, I power up the HS-Pi with a Li portable battery charger in the house and confirm it can communicate with the locks. I then walk into the garage and confirm that they communicate with those locks. This is done by locking and unlocking them. Same for the guest house. The issue is that, when I'm in the house, I cannot lock/unlock the garage or the guest house. If I'm in the garage, I cannot lock/unlock the house.

[Bigstevep]

Something you might want to check is if the locks are running Zwave or Zwave Plus. I had trouble with mine pairing and distance and found out that they were running Zwave ( Module 450191). When I switched them to Zwave Plus ( Module 450241) no more problems. You can find them on Ebay for around $30.

[drhtmal]

... As part of my testing, I power up the HS-Pi with a Li portable battery charger in the house and confirm it can communicate with the locks. I then walk into the garage and confirm that they communicate with those locks. This is done by locking and unlocking them. Same for the guest house. The issue is that, when I'm in the house, I cannot lock/unlock the garage or the guest house. If I'm in the garage, I cannot lock/unlock the house.

What is the purpose of powering the HS-PI with a battery?

How far apart are these buildings? Z-Wave can only travel so far. If you do not have Z-Wave connectivity in your out buildings you will need to add additional hardware to make this work.

[mc2software]

The battery is only so that I can walk between the buildings without having to restart the HS-Pi.

In the guest house, one lock works (closest) but the other does not, and none work in the garage when the hub is in the house. The closest garage lock is 50 ft from the guest house lock, so the forwarding should take care of that distance.

[randy]

It’s not forwarding, it is a mesh. The mesh must be built by communication and sometimes must be helped with manual optimization. One of my outbuildings is about 30-40 feet from the house. I managed to get items working in the building off of a single controller in the house initially years ago, but it was a challenge to build the routes. It took optimizing manually to build the routes, starting closest to the controller and working toward the lock in the shed.

Locks present a special challenge because (as was written above) they use “beaming” to wake them up. This process requires that every device between the controller and locks support beaming, some Z-Wave devices do not. 50 feet will require at least one device (possibly two) between the lock and the controller.

I finally ended up adding a Z-Net in each of the buildings, locks just wouldn’t work reliably until I did.

It is possible you could get them to work with a single controller, but they may not be reliable. My Zigbee devices will not work more than about 30-40 feet from the controller, so I have a pair of those hubs as well.

Lastly, the new V4 Z-Wave plug-in’s are still missing a crucial routing tools that made it possible to force a route, that was possible with the legacy plug-ins. In the legacy plug-in you could manually force a route or clear it altogether. The V4 plug-in only provides for full optimize. If you are still running 3.0.11.0 or earlier these tools are there.

[drhtmal]

The battery is only so that I can walk between the buildings without having to restart the HS-Pi.

In the guest house, one lock works (closest) but the other does not, and none work in the garage when the hub is in the house. The closest garage lock is 50 ft from the guest house lock, so the forwarding should take care of that distance.

The problem is that your HS-Pi and the z-wave radio inside it, is too far away from the locks.

You will need to add additional z-wave devices between the buildings to help strengthen your mesh or you will need to add additional z-nets in each building.

Since it appears you already have WiFi at the out buildings it would probably be easiest to install z-nets in each building. The z-nets will allow you to back haul the z-wave over the WiFi network back your HS-Pi in the main building. You know this should work since you can bring your HS-Pi to the out buildings and the locks work.

You could try adding additional z-wave devices to bridge the gap between the HS-Pi and the locks. His will be a bit of a trial and error thing since you will have to place the new z-wave devices between the locks and the HS-Pi hub until you install enough new devices that you hsve strong mesh and the lock start to work.

[mc2software]

I suspect that the locks do not do forwarding, since that would impact battery life. I'm going to add some line voltage powered z-wave plugs that do forwarding (already have all the light switches I need and they're all wifi only).

[kenm]

I suspect that the locks do not do forwarding, since that would impact battery life. I'm going to add some line voltage powered z-wave plugs that do forwarding (already have all the light switches I need and they're all wifi only).

You are either not reading the posts above or you don't understand what they are telling you. For locks, you need more than a repeater. you need a device that supports "beaming". Yes, they'll need to be line powered but they also need to support beaming or they won't help.

[kenm]

How far is your guest house from your Zee's install location?
How far is your garage from your Zee's install location?
Do you have a wired network in each of these locations? If so you'd be much better off using Z-Net's to communicate with these remote locks.

Can't argue with that. Would likely give the fastest lock response time as well.

[mc2software]

You are either not reading the posts above or you don't understand what they are telling you.

With obnoxious comments like this I will ask that you no longer comment on this thread, as you have obviously not been reading my replies.

[TC1]

With obnoxious comments like this I will ask that you no longer comment on this thread, as you have obviously not been reading my replies.

No, he has been reading your comments, as have I. I tried explaining in the beginning how Z-wave networks and locks actually operate, but you seemed to have skipped right over that. Nowhere in your comments have you acknowledged an understanding of what will or will not work. So people will in effect stop trying to help as you try random things. And no need to ask, I will show myself out of this thread.