Troubleshooting help needed.

[RAM]

I am looking for any help in solving an RF problem I have. I was checking to see why a small remote wasn't working this morning and when I turned on the 'Very Detailed' logging I started seeing a flood of bad packet messages similar to this:

2/11/2012 12:59:58 PM ~!~AC-RF2 Processor~!~[Rcvr# 2 Type W800] Received RAW Bytes: A5 A2 D5 24 At 6839.82:0:0.1:ApndA:4
2/11/2012 12:59:58 PM ~!~AC-RF2 Processor~!~*Message packet was not recognized as actionable. (No action required, bad data, or valid transmission from an unregistered device)
(the 'raw bytes' changes but the message is the same and it occurs many times per second) All my devices show up as registered properly.

I have swapped the 2 W800 receivers I have in use and the problem is location specific - it stayed with my upstairs receiver. I then unplugged the antenna from that receiver and the 'noise' stopped, so it appears it isn't a problem with the receiver, but some actual transmissions being received. One at a time I have pulled the batteries from all my motion sensors and remotes, but to no avail, the noise continues. The remarkable thing is my system works even with all this activity that ACRF is dealing with. I don't know how long this has been going on as it is very infrequently that I set logging level to 'Very Detailed', usually only when I am debugging a problem.
Any ideas on what might be putting out this RF 'noise'. Or any other ideas on how to track it down?

[pbibm]

Looking at your detailed diagnosis, it seems like there is something out there that isn't necessarily yours or on your property. It shows up only when you have the one antenna connected which suggests it has higher gain and/or is closer to whatever it is.

If we eliminate your system (in total) as the problem and its something else, here are some questions:

• What is special about this antenna?
  • Is it the stock antenna?
  • Is it a special antenna like a scanner antenna (that's what I have)
  • Is it located higher or to one side of your house?
• Neighbors / area
  • Is it possible your neighbors even several house away are X10 users?
  • Are you near something in the 100+ mhz range like a TV or FM radio tower?

It could also be a harmonic or something else. Is it happening several times a second all the time? (24 hours a day)

[Oman]

Usually interference like this is very, very local. In almost all instances the interference is coming from something near the receiver, not the antenna. Even though removing the antenna stops all signals from being recognized, it doesn't mean that the interference is coming from the antenna. Try this: If this is a non-USB unit then put the power brick on an extension cord. Take the receiver and move it as close to the center of the room (as far away from the computer as possible.) Put the antenna right next to the receiver. Do you still get noise?

The receiver is very good at rejecting interference from the antenna, but if the RF is getting into the receiver itself it doesn't get filtered.

Jon

I am looking for any help in solving an RF problem I have. I was checking to see why a small remote wasn't working this morning and when I turned on the 'Very Detailed' logging I started seeing a flood of bad packet messages similar to this:

2/11/2012 12:59:58 PM ~!~AC-RF2 Processor~!~[Rcvr# 2 Type W800] Received RAW Bytes: A5 A2 D5 24 At 6839.82:0:0.1:ApndA:4
2/11/2012 12:59:58 PM ~!~AC-RF2 Processor~!~*Message packet was not recognized as actionable. (No action required, bad data, or valid transmission from an unregistered device)
(the 'raw bytes' changes but the message is the same and it occurs many times per second) All my devices show up as registered properly.

I have swapped the 2 W800 receivers I have in use and the problem is location specific - it stayed with my upstairs receiver. I then unplugged the antenna from that receiver and the 'noise' stopped, so it appears it isn't a problem with the receiver, but some actual transmissions being received. One at a time I have pulled the batteries from all my motion sensors and remotes, but to no avail, the noise continues. The remarkable thing is my system works even with all this activity that ACRF is dealing with. I don't know how long this has been going on as it is very infrequently that I set logging level to 'Very Detailed', usually only when I am debugging a problem.
Any ideas on what might be putting out this RF 'noise'. Or any other ideas on how to track it down?

[RAM]

Looking at your detailed diagnosis, it seems like there is something out there that isn't necessarily yours or on your property. It shows up only when you have the one antenna connected which suggests it has higher gain and/or is closer to whatever it is.

If we eliminate your system (in total) as the problem and its something else, here are some questions:

• What is special about this antenna?
  • Is it the stock antenna?
  • Is it a special antenna like a scanner antenna (that's what I have)
  • Is it located higher or to one side of your house?
• Neighbors / area
  • Is it possible your neighbors even several house away are X10 users?
  • Are you near something in the 100+ mhz range like a TV or FM radio tower?

It could also be a harmonic or something else. Is it happening several times a second all the time? (24 hours a day)

Nothing special about the antenna, not a scanner antenna. It's pretty much the stock antenna with a wire attached to the outside of the coax connector to act like a ground plane reflector. It is one of two W800's w/stock antennas I have. This is located on main floor near the middle of the house. The other one, located in the basement does not seem to be picking up any of this 'noise', so it can't be overly strong. I've kinda ruled out neighbors/area because I know of no one nearby who uses X10 and this is a constant flood of noise, not just an occasional signal or burst of signals. Also I can't think of anything electrical/electronic that I've added in the house recently. It happens a couple of times per second. I'll be keeping an eye on it to see how sustained it is. I only just noticed it this morning and it is still happening now (6 hrs later).

[RAM]

Usually interference like this is very, very local. In almost all instances the interference is coming from something near the receiver, not the antenna. Even though removing the antenna stops all signals from being recognized, it doesn't mean that the interference is coming from the antenna. Try this: If this is a non-USB unit then put the power brick on an extension cord. Take the receiver and move it as close to the center of the room (as far away from the computer as possible.) Put the antenna right next to the receiver. Do you still get noise?

The receiver is very good at rejecting interference from the antenna, but if the RF is getting into the receiver itself it doesn't get filtered.

Jon

I'll see if I have a serial extension cable to try this. I don't know what would have changed recently to start this up. Everything in my system has been static (hardware-wise) for many months now. This particular W800 has been in the same spot since I installed it probably 5 years ago (or more). Also I have tried turning off anything electronic near the receiver. No difference.

[Oman]

If you search the forums you will see a few other people describing the same thing. I get about 2 support emails a month with the same thing. In nearly all cases (I can't find one in my email logs that was actually an external noise source - and one was a bad W800) the problem was interference that came from no more than a few feet away from the receiver. Most often it was the PC itself or another device attached to it.

Jon

I'll see if I have a serial extension cable to try this. I don't know what would have changed recently to start this up. Everything in my system has been static (hardware-wise) for many months now. This particular W800 has been in the same spot since I installed it probably 5 years ago (or more). Also I have tried turning off anything electronic near the receiver. No difference.

[RAM]

If you search the forums you will see a few other people describing the same thing. I get about 2 support emails a month with the same thing. In nearly all cases (I can't find one in my email logs that was actually an external noise source - and one was a bad W800) the problem was interference that came from no more than a few feet away from the receiver. Most often it was the PC itself or another device attached to it.

Jon

I found a serial extension cable so I could move the W800.Then I actually turned OFF everything electronic within probably 15 ft. of the W800 and the 'noise' continued. I almost has to be an external noise source. The next thing I'm going to try is moving the other W800 I have to a more central location and see if it starts picking up this 'noise'.

[RAM]

Problem solved

I traced the problem to a bad W800 receiver. When I switched the two receivers (basement vs main floor) the 'noise' then started coming from the basement receiver. Switched them back and the 'noise' moved back to the main floor.
Now I guess I'm on the lookout for a new W800. I'll check here and on Cocoontech to see if anyone has an old one they will sell otherwise it's off to WGL for a new one.

[bmxtreme]

Curious, how old is your W800? I expect this thing to last rather long since a crappy CM11 can last 10yrs

[Rupp]

HomeSeer sells them as well.
http://store.homeseer.com/store/Search.aspx?k=w800

[RAM]

Curious, how old is your W800? I expect this thing to last rather long since a crappy CM11 can last 10yrs

It's old, probably >10 yrs.

[RAM]

HomeSeer sells them as well.
http://store.homeseer.com/store/Search.aspx?k=w800

I saw that. But do they have them in stock for immediate shipment?