ControlLinc & Plug-in

[jlegan]

My PLv2 with updated firmware will not be here until the 4th, but while I was planning my system tonight I ran into a scenario that I could not readily find the answer to.

Normally if you wanted to create an event in HS with X10, you could simple set your palmpad or other controller to a specific letter (D for example) and when D-5 was received, you could perform an action or actions based on receiving that code.

How does this work with an Insteon ControlLinc? Do you leave the button unlinked and if so, how to you handle the buttons reception within HS? Is it as simple as XX.XX.XX.1 or something to that effect for button 1 or is it more complicated?

Any insight is appreciated.

Thanks,

Jim

[jhimmel]

I am wondering the same thing.

In fact, I have an INSTEON KeypadLinc V2 dimmer and I would like to set one of the buttons to send an all-off, but I have not as yet found any way to do that. All I can do so far is link switches to buttons - but then the button is used for on and off.

But it gets worse. To get around the issue you present, I thought I would just leave my wireless X10 keypad around and let HS grab the X10 signals and perform the correct Insteon actions. But lo and hehold, after adding 25 or 30 Insteon switches and the PL USB, my X10 system is getting very flaky and my plan is currently not working.

At this point, I am having all kinds of problems with both Insteon and X10 and I have no idea if the plugin is the problem, if the 2814U is the problem, or if Insteon and X10 really can NOT co-exist in scale.

[Oman]

Use a W800 or RFXCom to receive RF commands. You can then have an event fire off any Insteon or any other device commands you want without clogging up the powerline with X10.

Jon

My PLv2 with updated firmware will not be here until the 4th, but while I was planning my system tonight I ran into a scenario that I could not readily find the answer to.

Normally if you wanted to create an event in HS with X10, you could simple set your palmpad or other controller to a specific letter (D for example) and when D-5 was received, you could perform an action or actions based on receiving that code.

How does this work with an Insteon ControlLinc? Do you leave the button unlinked and if so, how to you handle the buttons reception within HS? Is it as simple as XX.XX.XX.1 or something to that effect for button 1 or is it more complicated?

Any insight is appreciated.

Thanks,

Jim

[Oman]

The plug-in does not current support any type of reception of Insteon commands. Therefore you would have to assign an X10 command to the button you want and have HomeSeer run Insteon commands based on the X10 reception.

Jon

I am wondering the same thing.

In fact, I have an INSTEON KeypadLinc V2 dimmer and I would like to set one of the buttons to send an all-off, but I have not as yet found any way to do that. All I can do so far is link switches to buttons - but then the button is used for on and off.

But it gets worse. To get around the issue you present, I thought I would just leave my wireless X10 keypad around and let HS grab the X10 signals and perform the correct Insteon actions. But lo and hehold, after adding 25 or 30 Insteon switches and the PL USB, my X10 system is getting very flaky and my plan is currently not working.

At this point, I am having all kinds of problems with both Insteon and X10 and I have no idea if the plugin is the problem, if the 2814U is the problem, or if Insteon and X10 really can NOT co-exist in scale.

[jlegan]

Jon,

You answered my question with the statement that the plug-in does not support the reception of Insteon commands.

Do you know if this is scheduled for an upcoming release?

Thanks,

Jim

[Rupp]

This simply amazes me that we have these new switches and have to use an older technology to get the status and or trigger an event. Does Insteon not support this or is it just to hard to impliment?

[jlegan]

This simply amazes me that we have these new switches and have to use an older technology to get the status and or trigger an event. Does Insteon not support this or is it just to hard to impliment?

I thought it was just me that wanted to say that...

[pkoslow]

The plug-in does not current support any type of reception of Insteon commands. Therefore you would have to assign an X10 command to the button you want and have HomeSeer run Insteon commands based on the X10 reception.

Jon

Bummer - I'll be starting with my first Insteon stuff tomorrow and made the assumption without reading up on the plug-in that it would support received Insteon commands.

As Jim asked... any chance of this being added in a future release of the plug-in?

Thanks,
Paul

[jlegan]

Paul,

With my latest order which should be here Tuesday, my entire house will be Insteon... I have been waiting since late September for the plug-in to really do what I need to do and this just put a small crimp in my plans, oh well. Here is to hoping that future releases will be more useful.

Jim

[Rupp]

I added X10 codes to all of my Insteon switches and they update their status immediately.

[Oman]

X10 is established within HomeSeer and it is simple addressing. With Insteon there are a number of issues, like the fact that switches don't actually report anything - they have to actually have the computer interface setup as a "slave" so that the switch thinks it is controlling the interface as a light. Then you have the issue of trying to sniff the Insteon traffic to see if some other device is trying to control a light registered with HomeSeer. This is actually the hardest thing becaue unlike X10 Insteon controllers don't actually command lights they just send out group requests. It is up to the light to determine if and what it is going to do so in order for HomeSeer to know what it actually did HomeSeer needs to have a copy of the switches internal link tables.

Soooo there is a bunch of stuff that the plug-in has to do in order to get there. It is all about resources. With enough demand it will get done. Insteon has to reach critical mass.

I thought that the functionality of the plug-in was clear in the description... Only control of Insteon devices. It's not my decision, HS or someone else would have to want to invest the time.

Jon

This simply amazes me that we have these new switches and have to use an older technology to get the status and or trigger an event. Does Insteon not support this or is it just to hard to impliment?

[jhimmel]

Use a W800 or RFXCom to receive RF commands. You can then have an event fire off any Insteon or any other device commands you want without clogging up the powerline with X10.

Jon

Good idea. I was unaware of this option. I just ordered a W800.

Thanks.

[ehill99]

Then you have the issue of trying to sniff the Insteon traffic to see if some other device is trying to control a light registered with HomeSeer. This is actually the hardest thing becaue unlike X10 Insteon controllers don't actually command lights they just send out group requests. It is up to the light to determine if and what it is going to do so in order for HomeSeer to know what it actually did HomeSeer needs to have a copy of the switches internal link tables.

Why does the HS need a copy of the switch's internal link table? It would be nice, and it would make things easier to setup. But, if a master relationship is setup between the switch and the PLC, when the switch status is changed, the PLC knows about it.

For example, I have a SwitchLinc with a master and slave relationship to the PLC. (Have to set that linking up manually, which is a pain... But, the relationship is there for this discussion.)

I just turned the light (00.c8.3a) on manually, and immediately the SDM General Log says:

PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 00 01 CF 11 00
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 45 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4A 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 45 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4A 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4F 11 01

I just got the SDK, and haven't looked at anything yet. But, I assume the PLC knows that the light is now on. It's obvious that it knows something with 00.C8.3A just happened.

The plug-in can't keep a connection open to the SDM?

Eric

[Oman]

Start reading the docs... you will be amazed!

Current Insteon devices communicate using group commands - no destination and no set function. All the PLC got was a group activate. What that means is completely up to the PLC. What it means to the switch is completely up to the switch. Without knowing what the switch is going to DO with that command (which is in the switches link tables) you can't know if it went on, off, 50% dim, or stood on it's head and yelled FIRE!

Jon

Why does the HS need a copy of the switch's internal link table? It would be nice, and it would make things easier to setup. But, if a master relationship is setup between the switch and the PLC, when the switch status is changed, the PLC knows about it.

For example, I have a SwitchLinc with a master and slave relationship to the PLC. (Have to set that linking up manually, which is a pain... But, the relationship is there for this discussion.)

I just turned the light (00.c8.3a) on manually, and immediately the SDM General Log says:

PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 00 01 CF 11 00
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 45 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4A 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=02
PLC:eventraw=03
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=02 00 C8 3A 00 D4 CC 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 45 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4A 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4F 11 01
PLC:eventraw=01
PLC:receiveinsteonraw=01 00 C8 3A 00 D6 1E 4F 11 01

I just got the SDK, and haven't looked at anything yet. But, I assume the PLC knows that the light is now on. It's obvious that it knows something with 00.C8.3A just happened.

The plug-in can't keep a connection open to the SDM?

Eric

[Rupp]

Jon,
This sounds like a serious design flaw. Is it?