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Advice needed on splitting a zwave network into 2 separate networks

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    Advice needed on splitting a zwave network into 2 separate networks

    I want to split my network, I have too many issues with delays, unresponsive devices etc (covered in another thread). I have 69 nodes, and now want to start splitting some off to a separate network. I can exclude on my Znet (my first network) and then include to the new one. Then I will have to change all events and scripts, and do that for every device. Painful but that will work. I was just wondering if there is an easier way, or any other advice on splitting a network would be appreciated.

    #2
    I don’t have advise on how to split the network, but are you sure splitting it will resolve your issues? Without knowing the root cause, you may go through the effort and not be better off at the end. I have over 100 devices in my network in 3600 sq ft of space and my network is reliable. If in your current network all or most devices have a direct route to the zwave controller, then there’s a chance that splitting it may make it worse as both z-wave controllers will be transmitting on the same frequency so may interfere with traffic from the other. How often are you polling your devices, are there other possible sources of interference in that frequency band, what is your layout, how many routing devices vs battery powered ones, etc.?
    HS 3.0.0.548: 1990 Devices 1172 Events
    Z-Wave 3.0.1.262: 126 Nodes on one Z-Net

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      #3
      I have 69 nodes, of which about 18 are battery powered 8 of them zwave+,. 15 or so of the mains powered devices are zwave+. The house isn't big, i guess 2200 sq ft, ground floor and one floor above, but solid brick walls. I did have some communication issues with some devices in the house, until i replaced the unreliable ones with zwave+ ones. WiFi coverage isn't that great either, I think some of the walls block signals.
      My network has been rock solid though for months. I had reduced polling to nearly nothing, and only on vital devices as that was the cause for issues before. But with a very reduced polling, all had been good. It all started shortly after I upgraded from zwave .190 to .248 (then later to .249). I first thought that might have been the issue (I posted in a separate post but did not get any response) but I'm not so sure any more. It started after the upgrade that devices had been slow to respond to commands. The it got gradually worse. It got to a point now, where my network locks up completely, not responding to any commands every few hours until a restart of the zwave PI or HS3.
      My thought was splitting off some devices in my lounge which is near the HS3 pc, where I have my znet and then also the second controller. I probably have about 20 zwave devices in the longe, and thought I'd split off all AV stuff into a separate network. That would leave enough other devices as 'relays', lower the overall traffic on the network, and I could increase polling slightly on the AV stuff. That was my thought...

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        #4
        mikee123
        I don't think splitting a Z-Wave network will help you. My understanding is that all Z-Wave devices, even if on different Home IDs, transmit using the same frequency band in the same channel (unlike other protocols which can use frequency hopping or other techniques to create sub-channels in a band). If you were to split your network, not only would you lose route diversity, you may end up with more interference on the network since the multiple controllers may end up simultaneously broadcasting on the same channel.

        Some other thoughts ...
        Have you tried to re-start the Z-Wave controller (from the [Plug-Ins] -> [Z-Wave] -> [Controller Management] -> [Actions] menu? Sometimes that helps..


        Another technique I found in these forums, and which I've occasionally used to resolve network problems is shutting down HomeSeer, deleting the Z-Wave network routing database (on Windows, that's the file "Z-Wave.db" found in C:\Program Files (x86)\HomeSeer HS3\Data\Z-Wave ), then re-starting HomeSeer which rebuilds the database. But definitely do a backup first in case deleting the database goes wrong! I also found I had to do an "Optimize a Network" one or more times (each time followed by "Test Node Connectivity on a Network") and then, after all the nodes show as being reachable, do a "Fully Optimize a Network" after this (some say this shouldn't be needed with Z-Wave plus devices, but I have a mix of "Plus" and "old" devices and my experience is that it helps).

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          #5
          Originally posted by jvm View Post
          mikee123

          Some other thoughts ...
          Have you tried to re-start the Z-Wave controller (from the [Plug-Ins] -> [Z-Wave] -> [Controller Management] -> [Actions] menu? Sometimes that helps..

          This I found does help when the network locks up I have asked in a different post of how to do that via en event (its not in actions so would have to be a script command). My thought was doing this every 6 hours or so until I have found the root cause of the issues. Someone suggested Jon00's plugin which can turn plugins on/off. Thats another option which might help, as a disable/enable of the zwave Pi helps most of the time (although sometimes even that doesn't work and I need a HS3 restart)

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            #6
            My first guess is that your z-wave interface may be going bad or is corrupted or you have a mis-behaving device. I’m running the same z-wave plugin version and have not seem those issues, so it happening after the upgrades is likely coincidence. Some things to try (not at the same time):

            - turn of the main breaker in the house to “reboot” all mains powered devices
            - backup your zwave interface, erase it and then restore your backup to it. You’ll likely need to re optimize the network again
            - backup your zwave interface, replace it, restore your backup and optimize the network
            HS 3.0.0.548: 1990 Devices 1172 Events
            Z-Wave 3.0.1.262: 126 Nodes on one Z-Net

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              #7
              That sounds like a plan. I know how to back up the network, but not sure how to erase it ? The option I see is erase this network and create a new one. Is that the one I should use ?

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                #8
                Yes, that's it. The restore will put your old network back.

                PS Even though I currently don't have issues, I have had issues in the past and have done all those things myself to resolve z-wave network issues.
                HS 3.0.0.548: 1990 Devices 1172 Events
                Z-Wave 3.0.1.262: 126 Nodes on one Z-Net

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by sparkman View Post

                  PS Even though I currently don't have issues, I have had issues in the past and have done all those things myself to resolve z-wave network issues.
                  Haha, that seems to be the case. I like the 'currently'. A few months and you think its all working fine, then boom and it all goes t.ts up...

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by mikee123 View Post

                    Haha, that seems to be the case. I like the 'currently'. A few months and you think its all working fine, then boom and it all goes t.ts up...
                    Yes, it certainly can, although, knock on wood, mine has been reliable for quite a few years now.
                    HS 3.0.0.548: 1990 Devices 1172 Events
                    Z-Wave 3.0.1.262: 126 Nodes on one Z-Net

                    Comment


                      #11
                      If you're going to erase and restore your network, make sure your interface supports the restore function (you'll see a restore function in the Z-Wave Actions menu if it does support restore). Some interfaces only support backup and don't restore. At least the HomeSeer SmartStick+ does support both backup and restore.

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                        #12
                        I have the Znet (I think v2), so that does support restore.

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by sparkman View Post
                          My first guess is that your z-wave interface may be going bad or is corrupted or you have a mis-behaving device. I’m running the same z-wave plugin version and have not seem those issues, so it happening after the upgrades is likely coincidence. Some things to try (not at the same time):

                          - turn of the main breaker in the house to “reboot” all mains powered devices
                          - backup your zwave interface, erase it and then restore your backup to it. You’ll likely need to re optimize the network again
                          - backup your zwave interface, replace it, restore your backup and optimize the network
                          I did a erase and restore for my network, then used the zseer+ to optimize a few nodes which had 3 or 4 hops. All working well after that. Due to a few changes I had to reboot HS3 a few times since. Now, after running 4 days without a reboot, my zwave locked up again. I disabled the zwave PI, enabled it again, and its running ok again. So there are still some issues, but not nearly as bad as before.

                          I have installed Jon00's PI to enable/disable plugins. I wonder if it is a good idea to disable/enable the zwave PI every night at 2am...

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