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    New Install Questions

    Hello everyone, first post here! (collective sigh)

    I'm in the middle of a move to a new home, leaving a home I built back in 2006 which I automated with an HAI Omni II (later upgraded to a IIE) and HAI UPB switches. Overall I was very pleased with the way things worked, it proved to be very reliable and responsive.

    Now I find myself moving to a new house and looking to add in new things that have become available since 2006 so I'll be adding HomeSeer to the mix as well as some Alexa.
    I still plan on using an Omni for the security end, all the wired door/window/pir etc will go to that unit. After that I'm not sure if I should stay with UPB or move to Insteon which "sounds" like it has all the goodness of powerline communication with RF mesh. So here come the questions that I hope I can get some input on.

    - Does anyone have experience with using Omni zone status to trigger Insteon lights, and if so is it as responsive as "standalone" Omni UPB solution? I was planning on using the Hub2 for the Insteon interface if that makes a difference.

    - If I stay with UPB is it better to let the Omni issue the commands with the PIM hooked to the Omni or should I use a PCS PIM-U on the HomeSeer box and send UPB commands from Homeseer based on Omni zone status? Is there any difference in responsiveness here

    - Related to the above, is it possible to use the PCS PIM-S directly on the Omni? I see that PCS has a PCS OPA adapter for this purpose but I've not found hide nor hair of that item. Is that simply the Leveton 36A05-2 HAU PIM to Serial adapter?

    I'm sure I'll have more questions as I begin to set things up since I've not used HomeSeer before, so far I have the HomeSeer software and the Omni plugin. But for now I'm just wanting to settle on the switch technology and PIM locatoin (Omni or HomeSeer box).

    Thanks!

    #2
    After that I'm not sure if I should stay with UPB or move to Insteon which "sounds" like it has all the goodness of powerline communication with RF mesh.

    The OmniPro panel does not speak Insteon. Years ago here did transition to Insteon and use X10 PIM to speak to the Insteon devices.

    Over the years went from Insteon wall switches to UPB. It's been fine for me.

    If I stay with UPB is it better to let the Omni issue the commands with the PIM hooked to the Omni or should I use a PCS PIM-U on the HomeSeer box and send UPB commands from Homeseer based on Omni zone status? Is there any difference in responsiveness here

    I use the Omni Panel and Homeseer to send UPB commands. I also utilize a couple of UPB PIM floaters connected to serial to ethernet interfaces to do diagnostics sometimes.

    Related to the above, is it possible to use the PCS PIM-S directly on the Omni? I see that PCS has a PCS OPA adapter for this purpose but I've not found hide nor hair of that item. Is that simply the Leveton 36A05-2 HAU PIM to Serial adapter?

    Made a PCS serial to OP2 panel adapter a couple of years back for a CT user. He is still using it today. Easy peasey to make with an RJ to RS-232 unpinned cable adapter.
    - Pete

    Auto mator
    Homeseer 3 Pro - 3.0.0.548 (Linux) - Ubuntu 18.04/W7e 64 bit Intel Haswell CPU 16Gb- Mono 6.8X
    Homeseer Zee2 (Lite) - 3.0.0.548 (Linux) - Ubuntu 18.04/W7e - CherryTrail x5-Z8350 BeeLink 4Gb BT3 Pro - Mono 6.8X
    HS4 Pro - V4.1.2.0 - Ubuntu 18.04/VB W7e 64 bit Intel Kaby Lake CPU - 32Gb - Mono 6.10.0.104
    HS4 Lite -

    X10, UPB, Zigbee, ZWave and Wifi MQTT automation. OmniPro 2, Russound zoned audio, Smartthings hub, Hubitat Hub, and Home Assistant

    Comment


      #3
      Pete,

      Thank you for you input on this.

      I use the Omni Panel and Homeseer to send UPB commands
      Just to clarify ... is the PIM on the Omni or your Homeseer computer?

      Is the sequence Omni zone triggers ->, Homeseer omni plugin sees the event -> Homeseer logic/program tells Omni to send the light on command (PIM is on the Omni serial).

      What PIM do you use, is the old HAI one still a good choice or is the PCS one really improved as they claim on thier website.

      Made a PCS serial to OP2 panel adapter
      Is there a pin-out diagram available, or if I did not want to do this myself an off the shelf cable/adapter available?

      Steve

      Comment


        #4
        is the PIM on the Omni or your Homeseer computer?

        The HAI UPB PIM is on the OmniPro 2 panel and an SA PIM is on the Homeseer computer. Other Floaters are PCS or HAI UPB PIMs.

        Primary PIM of use is the HAI UPB PIM. Only updates to UPB over the years has been adding a dual UPB HAI / PCS phase repeater.

        Initially here with beginning of UPB in wall switches used PCS, SA and HAI switches. Over the years went to all SA switches - multiple toggle, dual load, et al.

        I use some Zone detection for UPB illumination which is primarily done on the panel using the panel automation lines. It is he OmniPro panel still speaks X10, ZWave and Zigbee. IE: X10 is used for Christmas decorations.

        I utilize Homeseer / Omni plugin stuff for higher levels of automation with more device interaction.

        Is there a pin-out diagram available, or if I did not want to do this myself an off the shelf cable/adapter available?

        Yes will reference pics / docs posted a few years ago on CT. Will repost over here. I initially extended the X10 / UPB PIMs using cat5e which was too thick for the panel so went to using old telephone cable (4-6 cable) a couple of years ago. The OP2 panel and fuse panel are about 25 feet apart such that I installed a couple of circuits with dedicated outlets for the PIMs adjacent to the fuse panel on breakers. I also upgraded the X10 TW523 to a dual phased Volp PIM. The HAI VRCOP and HAI Zigbee ZIM sit adjacent to the OmniPro 2 panel. The shelf cable adapter unpinned is less than $5.00. For the HAI UPB PIM with RJ connection is is just a regular telephone jack flipped on either side for data versus voice.

        Electricity here in the midwest near Chicago is all in metal conduit and all wall boxes are 4X4 metal boxes with single or double mud plates.

        2->2 (RD)
        3->3 (TD)
        4->4 (DTR)
        5->5 (ground)

        Click image for larger version  Name:	9_PIN_PIN_OUT.GIF Views:	1 Size:	30.8 KB ID:	1262116

        Click image for larger version  Name:	HAI-Serial Port pinout.jpg Views:	1 Size:	9.3 KB ID:	1262117
        Click image for larger version  Name:	DIY-HAI-UPBPIMRS-232.jpg Views:	1 Size:	65.0 KB ID:	1262118

        NOTE: only need 4 wires: ground, DCD, RX and TX

        xxxx
        Last edited by Pete; November 26, 2018, 11:25 AM.
        - Pete

        Auto mator
        Homeseer 3 Pro - 3.0.0.548 (Linux) - Ubuntu 18.04/W7e 64 bit Intel Haswell CPU 16Gb- Mono 6.8X
        Homeseer Zee2 (Lite) - 3.0.0.548 (Linux) - Ubuntu 18.04/W7e - CherryTrail x5-Z8350 BeeLink 4Gb BT3 Pro - Mono 6.8X
        HS4 Pro - V4.1.2.0 - Ubuntu 18.04/VB W7e 64 bit Intel Kaby Lake CPU - 32Gb - Mono 6.10.0.104
        HS4 Lite -

        X10, UPB, Zigbee, ZWave and Wifi MQTT automation. OmniPro 2, Russound zoned audio, Smartthings hub, Hubitat Hub, and Home Assistant

        Comment


          #5
          Thanks for the wiring diagram ... very helpful!

          When using the Omni for the UPB commands is the Omni plugin updated with switch status as well?

          Since you are using mostly SA switches you do not use HLC, so do you just have some extra programming in the Omni to poll / track switch status? I read that the SA switches were not Gen III, I don't know if that's true or even important. Just curious why you selected SA ones over Leviton.

          Steve

          Comment


            #6
            Remember that all you need is 4 wires. Easy HAI UPB PIM to OmniPro Panel connection is just an old 4 wire flat telephone cable with the RJ-11 jacks flipped. Using the RS-232 to RJ connector here used a pin by pin checking with a VOM. The connectors I used had labels on the inside and outside RS-232 pins to make it easier.

            I do not utilize HLC with UPB on the OmniPro panel. An HAI HLC switch is a bit different than an SA or PCS switch. You can program it via an OmniTouch screen or the PCA program. You are tracking Links versus actual UPB commands on the OmniPro panel.

            so do you just have some extra programming in the Omni to poll / track switch status?

            I am not tracking switch status with the OmniPro 2 panel.

            It was just a personal preference not to use HLC. There are a few Cocoontech members that have switched to only using HAI HLC switches and doing all of the home automation today with their OmniPro 2 panels with no side mounted automation software. Here continue to utilize old Omnitouch (serial) and newer IP Omnitouch screens along with Homeseer HSTouch screens. My wife preferred utilizing the Keypad for alarm functions until a couple of years ago. Fast and easy for her.

            For a while got caught up in the UPB Gen stuff. I updated to newer SA switches for use with multiple function multiple paddle face plates and dual load switches.

            IE: Kitchen was on a few switches and many three way switches. Here went to a couple of 6 paddle switches to control all of the lights in the kitchen via links.

            Used to track UPB switches and personally see no need. Leaving the house to automate by itself these days and used to pay attention in the early 2000's.

            IE: do not every touch the Omnistat as it works fine with no handholding. I do watch status on it. WAF got turned off by the follow me lighting around the house (using PIRs) so disabled most of it except for outside coaches and inside garage lighting.

            Automation is addicting.

            I used to watch the CCTV cameras to make sure the irrigation was working or that the outside coach lights were on. It always worked. Went overboard on it and added a separate water meter to watch the water flow digitally.
            - Pete

            Auto mator
            Homeseer 3 Pro - 3.0.0.548 (Linux) - Ubuntu 18.04/W7e 64 bit Intel Haswell CPU 16Gb- Mono 6.8X
            Homeseer Zee2 (Lite) - 3.0.0.548 (Linux) - Ubuntu 18.04/W7e - CherryTrail x5-Z8350 BeeLink 4Gb BT3 Pro - Mono 6.8X
            HS4 Pro - V4.1.2.0 - Ubuntu 18.04/VB W7e 64 bit Intel Kaby Lake CPU - 32Gb - Mono 6.10.0.104
            HS4 Lite -

            X10, UPB, Zigbee, ZWave and Wifi MQTT automation. OmniPro 2, Russound zoned audio, Smartthings hub, Hubitat Hub, and Home Assistant

            Comment

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