Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

New Home Construction, All Insteon outlets/switches, few getting started questions

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #16
    I'm back....so 99% of the outlets in my house are the dual band insteon..as I'm finishing up the first floor lighting switches I'm seeing all excellent message ratings but a handful of 2 and 3 hops with some at 70% comm quality already. Do I need to add my outlets to the homeseer system in order for them to be part of the whole insteon communication? Just wondering if adding them will greatly increase the communication quality. Im a tech guy so I had outlets spaced a bit closer than most and that equals a **** ton of outlets to add that I wasn't going to mess with until I had the lighting finished.

    Comment


      #17
      Originally posted by alaskan84 View Post
      So Ive reset my s6, setup your plugin and added the first switch in the utility room. it took multiple attempts to read each database entry for remote links and then eventually failed with the message the link table could not be read...does this indicate a comm issue? I'm going to reset this switch, and try programming it for homeseer once more then I will try moving my plm...
      typically this does indicate a comm issue; especially after a factory reset. did you move the PLM location?

      Originally posted by alaskan84 View Post
      So after resetting the switch it again failed configuration with the plugin. I was able to see it read some links and at least one was invalid...so I removed the links in the plugin which seemed successful and then deleted the switch and when I added it back it had only 3 links and programmed successfully....second switch is giving me the same story so it's almost like I need to bring them into homeseer, clear their links and the add them again...I would have thought doing the factory reset would remove any links but maybe I messed up the first process....second one seemed to just add now after the factory reset so it'll probably be best for me to reset each switch before adding back
      a factory reset if performed correctly will erase the device links.

      Originally posted by alaskan84 View Post
      One last question for tonight....when linking two devices in the plugin, I configured the first switch to be linked to the second switch and selected cross link. The behavior is great with both switch's in sync yet in the software I only see cross links with switch a...switch b has no visible links to switch a...should I need to link a to b, and then specifically b back to a or is that happening automatically?
      the cross link should create links from a to b, and b to a automatically. it builds a virtual 3-way circuit.

      Originally posted by alaskan84 View Post
      I just wanted to say thanks and that it's all making a little more sense creating links now that I'm using your plugin for a few hours..the first couple switches I was fully resetting them like a first born child in cloth diapers...by the fourth switch I've figured out that I can just add it, and then program for homeseer and usually just delete one bad link...disposable diaper style haha..I'm probably not going to get to my tricky 4 way until tomorrow night but I'm hoping to have my entire first floor lights working tonight
      sounds like you're making progress.

      Originally posted by alaskan84 View Post
      I'm back....so 99% of the outlets in my house are the dual band insteon..as I'm finishing up the first floor lighting switches I'm seeing all excellent message ratings but a handful of 2 and 3 hops with some at 70% comm quality already. Do I need to add my outlets to the homeseer system in order for them to be part of the whole insteon communication? Just wondering if adding them will greatly increase the communication quality. Im a tech guy so I had outlets spaced a bit closer than most and that equals a **** ton of outlets to add that I wasn't going to mess with until I had the lighting finished.
      you do not need to add outletlinc or any device to the plugin in order for them to be part of the insteon network; they take care of that themselves. the plugin does make manage the insteon network in any way. You only need to add devices to the plugin that you want to control via homeseer.
      Mark

      HS3 Pro 4.2.19.5
      Hardware: Insteon Serial PLM | AD2USB for Vista Alarm | HAI Omnistat2 | 1-Wire HA7E | RFXrec433 | Dahua Cameras | LiftMaster Internet Gateway | Tuya Smart Plugs
      Plugins: Insteon (mine) | Vista Alarm (mine) | Omnistat 3 | Ultra1Wire3 | RFXCOM | HS MyQ | BLRadar | BLDenon | Tuya | Jon00 Charting | Jon00 Links
      Platform: Windows Server 2022 Standard, i5-12600K/3.7GHz/10 core, 16GB RAM, 500GB SSD

      Comment


        #18
        Wow, what a night....I managed to finally get the final devices in my master bedroom programmed but not after multiple, multiple programming attempts. I've absolutely got something going wrong and Im wondering if you can in anyway point me at what to look at first, or have the electrician check first. So I haven't touched the couple hundred outlet links I have, but most of the lighting is programmed. A mixture of dimmers, keypad links, a few on off modules for flourescents and 3 fanlincs for the master bedroom fans. Now all of the overhead lights in the master bedroom are on a breaker separate from the fans and switches..when programming the keypad links and the fanlincs almost all of the lights and keypads in the house surge. While programming the fanlinks and the lights were flickering I could hear the fan motor actually surging as the lights blink. I would say 75% of the time if I use the all off command or the all on command it will trip the breaker for the overhead lights upstairs...same risk just during the programming of the fanlincs almost like the data packets they are trying to send are just causing a mess of the power.. I've also noticed quick flickers of all the lights as I've been working in the new place the last few days....I don't like the quick flickering, but I'm more concerned with the large blinking and flickering of the system when heavy communication happens. All of my devices show an excellent message quality however maybe 8 out of 80 devices are showing a handful of 3 hops...this is a brand new house that I haven't moved into yet, no furniture and besides my network gear, and a refrigerator, a handful of sonos speakers it's empty...I wish I could just call up knowledgeble smart things electrician but living on an island in Alaska there isn't anyone familiar with this type of system. I've considered bringing in a specialized electrician from off island but at this point I'm thinking that there is some sort of basic electrical issue that the local guys should be able to handle.....gah! Thanks for any help or insight that can be provided

        Comment


          #19
          And Mark, yes I did move the plm...previously it was plugged into the rack UPS and thinking about that I decided that could cause all sorts issues. I now have it plugged into an otherwise empty outlet Linc next to the rack.

          I could describe more quirks that I have seen but I think Ive said enough for us to think about right now lol.

          Thanks for all your advice mark

          Comment


            #20
            Sam,
            Plugging the plm into an outletlinc is not a good idea. do you have a standard outlet you can use?

            the Global Group sends one 8 byte message. then the plugin tries to verify that every device responded (called cleanup). you can disable cleanup on the config page. uncheck Perform group clean-ups when transmitting group commands

            insteon commands/mesages are only 5v on the powerline. there is something else going on if you are tripping breakers while sending commands.

            fluorescent bulbs can put noise on the powerline. RF is unaffected. can you narrow down the programming troubles to a specific circuit? usually this is an indication that something on the circuit is generating noise or eating the insteon signal (ie fluorescent bulbs)

            1. if you don't mind, post a screen shot of your stats from the Manage Device page. you can blank out the names and insteon ids if you wish. i want to see the other columns

            2. i would also like to see the info on the config page that looks like this:

            You have 130 internal Insteon device(s) registered in the system, 0 external device(s), and 8 group(s).
            These devices and groups currently consume 230 link database entries in your interface.*
            You have 243 unused outbound link addresses out of 254 total available.

            * Click the Display Interface Links button below to update this number.
            Mark

            HS3 Pro 4.2.19.5
            Hardware: Insteon Serial PLM | AD2USB for Vista Alarm | HAI Omnistat2 | 1-Wire HA7E | RFXrec433 | Dahua Cameras | LiftMaster Internet Gateway | Tuya Smart Plugs
            Plugins: Insteon (mine) | Vista Alarm (mine) | Omnistat 3 | Ultra1Wire3 | RFXCOM | HS MyQ | BLRadar | BLDenon | Tuya | Jon00 Charting | Jon00 Links
            Platform: Windows Server 2022 Standard, i5-12600K/3.7GHz/10 core, 16GB RAM, 500GB SSD

            Comment


              #21
              Hello Mark, I wont be able to get more info to you until I'm off work today but ill get you some screenshots of the stats and device configuration this evening. I do have a standard outlet that I can plug the PLM into and will move it to that first and retest the behavior.

              I will also see about getting one of our local electricians to come back and look into the breaker tripping issue since that should clearly be unrelated to the insteon system.

              Comment


                #22
                Let's see if these linked photos are readable...if not I'll take a couple screenshots directly from the hometroller

                https://photos.app.goo.gl/RfscrafCXjmuR0Xu2
                https://photos.app.goo.gl/kkR3R1CgkNInH7OD3
                https://photos.app.goo.gl/g7CGBhlku1v6U58p1

                Comment


                  #23
                  this all looks fine. Yah, next time, just use the screenshots. the pics don't scale well.

                  click on the "Comm Reliability %" to sort the lower values together. i would be curious of the devices that have a lower percentage are somehow related.
                  Mark

                  HS3 Pro 4.2.19.5
                  Hardware: Insteon Serial PLM | AD2USB for Vista Alarm | HAI Omnistat2 | 1-Wire HA7E | RFXrec433 | Dahua Cameras | LiftMaster Internet Gateway | Tuya Smart Plugs
                  Plugins: Insteon (mine) | Vista Alarm (mine) | Omnistat 3 | Ultra1Wire3 | RFXCOM | HS MyQ | BLRadar | BLDenon | Tuya | Jon00 Charting | Jon00 Links
                  Platform: Windows Server 2022 Standard, i5-12600K/3.7GHz/10 core, 16GB RAM, 500GB SSD

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Now i am going to move the PLM to a non smart outlet and actually remove my UPS from the equation all together; putting the switch and other network gear into the rack powerstrip and just plugging that into a wall outlet as well. I'm also going to unplug my refer/fridge...besides that everything else would be hardwired like the heating stuff and makeup air exchange system and i dont think there is anything left to unplug.

                    ....be back shortly after additional testing


                    btw, should the fields on your plugin be sortable? my device list is alphabetical and none of the columns seemed to be clickable/sortable.

                    Comment


                      #25
                      So i tried a couple different configurations and i "think" that the behavior is better by just moving the PLM to a non smart outlet. Its currently in a 20 amp outlet, in a double gang box. I did try to remove the UPS completely but i was still getting the occasional failed command so the ups is back in the equation and plugged into one of the two gang 20amp recepts. I'm not seeing any surging as i was before but im all done registering devices for now.

                      Still blowing one particular breaker on the ALL ON global command, but not 100% of the time. if i do a ramp on command, wait a few seconds and then give it an all on i havent gotten it to trip the breaker but from all off to all on does it most of the time. Going to leave that issue for the electrician at this point.

                      I had two switches that when tapped on and off in sequence locally at the switches themselves a few times they would start lagging and you could visually see the LED stop for a moment during the ramp and then start up again. I havent been able to reproduce this after the PLM move. I also found a kitchen fixture on a dimmer that had florescents and was whining...swapped those bulbs for led tubes so maybe removing those helped a tad.

                      Two new questions

                      When running the all on command, is there a particular suspect reason why a handful of switches would regularly not report back to homeseer as on although they seemed to respect the all on command?

                      Lastly, which maybe these are all still related to an underlying comms issue...running commands through homeseer, twice the homeseer interface went unresponsive for almost 3 minutes...then the whole house would catch up and every light would go on and off and then individual commands would catch up...This happened a couple times, more often when running the large all on all off commands which i really dont anticipate using the all on much ever but to show things off...still, getting 3 minute lag times before everything catches up does not make me look good haha.

                      Thanks for your help Mark, its pretty damn nice to see you here responding to everyones questions as you are

                      Comment


                        #26
                        One more thing...I noticed that the breakers for my insteon phase coupler were not on...so i flipped those two and did some more comms tests...nothing changed that i can really tell. I figured i should to a 4 tap test to see what the results are...all across the first floor, switches are blinking green with white and then some with white and red...i assume thats both phases working...outlet lincs appear to be blinking two red, and then two green in sequence...i went upstairs and at the top of the stairs the first few outletlincs are blinking...the rest are all solid green. Looking at my switches upstairs, i have 2 3 gang boxes and 2 out of the 3 are blinking and the other 2 are just sitting there. None of my keypadlincs that i have upstairs linked to the fanlincs are blinking however the downstairs keypad is blinking as it should...I'm thinking this could be an issue for the electrician but if we could point him in the right direction as to why most of the upstairs wouldnt be blinking during the phase test...or do we circle right back to comms issues still? certain devices may not be blinking because they missed the phase test message?

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by alaskan84 View Post
                          So i tried a couple different configurations and i "think" that the behavior is better by just moving the PLM to a non smart outlet. Its currently in a 20 amp outlet, in a double gang box. I did try to remove the UPS completely but i was still getting the occasional failed command so the ups is back in the equation and plugged into one of the two gang 20amp recepts. I'm not seeing any surging as i was before but im all done registering devices for now.

                          Still blowing one particular breaker on the ALL ON global command, but not 100% of the time. if i do a ramp on command, wait a few seconds and then give it an all on i havent gotten it to trip the breaker but from all off to all on does it most of the time. Going to leave that issue for the electrician at this point.

                          I had two switches that when tapped on and off in sequence locally at the switches themselves a few times they would start lagging and you could visually see the LED stop for a moment during the ramp and then start up again. I havent been able to reproduce this after the PLM move. I also found a kitchen fixture on a dimmer that had florescents and was whining...swapped those bulbs for led tubes so maybe removing those helped a tad.

                          Two new questions

                          When running the all on command, is there a particular suspect reason why a handful of switches would regularly not report back to homeseer as on although they seemed to respect the all on command?

                          Lastly, which maybe these are all still related to an underlying comms issue...running commands through homeseer, twice the homeseer interface went unresponsive for almost 3 minutes...then the whole house would catch up and every light would go on and off and then individual commands would catch up...This happened a couple times, more often when running the large all on all off commands which i really dont anticipate using the all on much ever but to show things off...still, getting 3 minute lag times before everything catches up does not make me look good haha.

                          Thanks for your help Mark, its pretty damn nice to see you here responding to everyones questions as you are

                          1. not sure why certain switches aren't reporting back. maybe later create a group in the plugin with just a handful of those switches and see how they respond. maybe they aren't getting the cleanup request.

                          2. did you try turning off the cleanup option? and testing the responsiveness. Anything in the log point to a 3 minute delay between log entries? you might need to enable detailed logging in the plugin to see where the delay is.
                          Mark

                          HS3 Pro 4.2.19.5
                          Hardware: Insteon Serial PLM | AD2USB for Vista Alarm | HAI Omnistat2 | 1-Wire HA7E | RFXrec433 | Dahua Cameras | LiftMaster Internet Gateway | Tuya Smart Plugs
                          Plugins: Insteon (mine) | Vista Alarm (mine) | Omnistat 3 | Ultra1Wire3 | RFXCOM | HS MyQ | BLRadar | BLDenon | Tuya | Jon00 Charting | Jon00 Links
                          Platform: Windows Server 2022 Standard, i5-12600K/3.7GHz/10 core, 16GB RAM, 500GB SSD

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Originally posted by alaskan84 View Post
                            One more thing...I noticed that the breakers for my insteon phase coupler were not on...so i flipped those two and did some more comms tests...nothing changed that i can really tell. I figured i should to a 4 tap test to see what the results are...all across the first floor, switches are blinking green with white and then some with white and red...i assume thats both phases working...outlet lincs appear to be blinking two red, and then two green in sequence...i went upstairs and at the top of the stairs the first few outletlincs are blinking...the rest are all solid green. Looking at my switches upstairs, i have 2 3 gang boxes and 2 out of the 3 are blinking and the other 2 are just sitting there. None of my keypadlincs that i have upstairs linked to the fanlincs are blinking however the downstairs keypad is blinking as it should...I'm thinking this could be an issue for the electrician but if we could point him in the right direction as to why most of the upstairs wouldnt be blinking during the phase test...or do we circle right back to comms issues still? certain devices may not be blinking because they missed the phase test message?
                            i really can't comment on the various blinking scenarios. each device is a little different. if the devices are the same fw version, they should be responding the same assume the plugin options selected are the same. That said, I typically don't bother with the led. i usually turn them Off or disable the blinking.

                            put a 10A filterlinc on your UPS.
                            Mark

                            HS3 Pro 4.2.19.5
                            Hardware: Insteon Serial PLM | AD2USB for Vista Alarm | HAI Omnistat2 | 1-Wire HA7E | RFXrec433 | Dahua Cameras | LiftMaster Internet Gateway | Tuya Smart Plugs
                            Plugins: Insteon (mine) | Vista Alarm (mine) | Omnistat 3 | Ultra1Wire3 | RFXCOM | HS MyQ | BLRadar | BLDenon | Tuya | Jon00 Charting | Jon00 Links
                            Platform: Windows Server 2022 Standard, i5-12600K/3.7GHz/10 core, 16GB RAM, 500GB SSD

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Hey Mark, as far as the filterlincs go, my UPS is an Eaton and requires a 20Amp outlet so the filterlincs would not work. I did throw a filterlinc on my garbage disposal and will use the other 4 I have as I deploy more electronics throughout the house. I've read that the x10 filters work for the insteon signal so I picked up a handful of them. Would it be worth trying to put one of these 20amp x10 filters behind the 20amp outlet the ups uses?
                              https://www.amazon.com/X10-XPF-Wired...+filter+20+amp


                              Overall I'm satisfied with how things are working currently. I've started programming groups associated with my KPL buttons and haven't ran into any major issues. The biggest thing is tracking down non dimmable bulbs that are hiding in bathroom circulation fans etc since they cause a whine with the dimmer switches.

                              I did have a question about a particular thing I am trying to accomplish in my guest bathroom.

                              Currently I have 3 switches, the first is a dimmer for the vanity, the second is an on/off toggle for the vent fan, and the third is the dimmer for the can lights and the vent fan light. Now my train of thought is that nobody ever uses the fan when they should....and even if they do as soon as they leave they turn it off and it does not have enough time to clear out that sweet rose smell....so the first thing I did was disable the LED on the switch for the fan, and then setup a link between the fan switch and the can lights dimmer switch...so you come in and turn the lights on and get the fan as well, all is well. I would like to take it a step further and have the fan remain on for anywhere from 3-5 minutes after someone has turned off the can lights. Any chance of pointing me in the right direction to accomplish that, basically set a delay before the linked device turns off. Thanks!

                              Comment


                                #30
                                don't bother with the 20a wired-in filter at this point. you would know by now if the UPS was causing problems. Also i don't think you need a filter on the garbage disposal. I've noticed these don't work on motor loads. Plus you don't run the disposal enough to cause an issue.

                                save the filterlincs for power strips that have a bunch of power adapters plugged in: for example on your stereo/home theater equipment or for desktop computers.

                                i would unlink the dimmer from the fan and use homeseer events to do what you want with the bathroom devices. You can trigger the fan to turn on when the light turns on, and then set another event to shut off the fan with a delay when the light gets turned off.

                                glad things are working out

                                btw, how many insteon devices do you have registered in the plugin?
                                Mark

                                HS3 Pro 4.2.19.5
                                Hardware: Insteon Serial PLM | AD2USB for Vista Alarm | HAI Omnistat2 | 1-Wire HA7E | RFXrec433 | Dahua Cameras | LiftMaster Internet Gateway | Tuya Smart Plugs
                                Plugins: Insteon (mine) | Vista Alarm (mine) | Omnistat 3 | Ultra1Wire3 | RFXCOM | HS MyQ | BLRadar | BLDenon | Tuya | Jon00 Charting | Jon00 Links
                                Platform: Windows Server 2022 Standard, i5-12600K/3.7GHz/10 core, 16GB RAM, 500GB SSD

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X