HS3 - Zigbee Plug-In

[Daweeze]

Hi MacroMark,

Regarding an HS3 Zigbee Plug-In......

In your post in this thread:

http://board.homeseer.com/showthread.php?t=172169

Specifically:

http://board.homeseer.com/showpost.p...5&postcount=13

You stated: "We're working on it Greg but let me tell you, it's not trivial!"

It looks like it has been some time since this statement was made. Do you know if there is any progress towards this effort or if it's no longer a valid statement. I am considering buying the Keen Home Smart Vents but confirmed with Nate @ Keen Home that they will not be doing any Z-Wave interface (My Preference).

He stated: "At this time we do not intend to build Z-wave versions of the Smart Vent, but we do integrate with SmartThings and Lowes IRIS, both of which do support both Z-wave and ZigBee protocols. We also plan to integrate with Wink."

I am looking for a solid solution, not hodge podge. If HS is still doing the Zigbee Plug-In, any news would be great. Otherwise, I would need others to chime in regarding Wink and SmartThings Plug-In support to see if these vents are even an option me. This isn't a Z-Wave vs Zigbee thing, I just prefer the Keen Home Smart Vent design and features over the current EcoVent Z-Wave option and was curious if getting it to function as a whole with HS is valid.

Thanks!

-Travis

[rmasonjr]

I'd like to know the status as well. Specifically, which receiver(s) are being supported.

[LeoS]

I'm interested in Zigbee as well.

[macromark]

Hi MacroMark,

Regarding an HS3 Zigbee Plug-In......

In your post in this thread:

http://board.homeseer.com/showthread.php?t=172169

Specifically:

http://board.homeseer.com/showpost.p...5&postcount=13

You stated: "We're working on it Greg but let me tell you, it's not trivial!"

It looks like it has been some time since this statement was made. Do you know if there is any progress towards this effort or if it's no longer a valid statement. I am considering buying the Keen Home Smart Vents but confirmed with Nate @ Keen Home that they will not be doing any Z-Wave interface (My Preference).

He stated: "At this time we do not intend to build Z-wave versions of the Smart Vent, but we do integrate with SmartThings and Lowes IRIS, both of which do support both Z-wave and ZigBee protocols. We also plan to integrate with Wink."

I am looking for a solid solution, not hodge podge. If HS is still doing the Zigbee Plug-In, any news would be great. Otherwise, I would need others to chime in regarding Wink and SmartThings Plug-In support to see if these vents are even an option me. This isn't a Z-Wave vs Zigbee thing, I just prefer the Keen Home Smart Vent design and features over the current EcoVent Z-Wave option and was curious if getting it to function as a whole with HS is valid.

Thanks!

-Travis

Travis - the options we investigated for Zigbee support were not as streamlined as we originally hoped so we've put this on hold again. We do, however, support the Econet Z-Wave vents. Would those work for you? http://www.econetcontrols.com/products.php Note that they are close to releasing a new series with more contemporary grills.

It's curious that Keen Home doesn't plan to support Z-Wave but does plan to integrate with Wink. Strange choices. http://www.businessinsider.com/more-...-quirky-2015-7 and now this: http://www.businessinsider.com/ben-k...-quirky-2015-8

[ServiceXp]

Well that news is a bit disappointing.

[Daweeze]

Travis - the options we investigated for Zigbee support were not as streamlined as we originally hoped so we've put this on hold again. We do, however, support the Econet Z-Wave vents. Would those work for you? http://www.econetcontrols.com/products.php Note that they are close to releasing a new series with more contemporary grills.

It's curious that Keen Home doesn't plan to support Z-Wave but does plan to integrate with Wink. Strange choices.

Hi Mark,

Thanks for the quick response. I am a fairly new and basic user and what I mean by that is I like to use the Plug-Ins and allow the developers to do the leg work that allows the control of the equipment I want to integrate. I am not really interested in scripting or script-based solutions. For instance, I have an Amazon Echo, I don't care to test with the versions people have come up with for getting it to work at this point and I instead will be completely relying on the Plug-In to allow the device to become part of my system. I love that this system is so advanced that the ability to script and create Plug-Ins is not only accepted but is encouraged.

So here's the rub then, people are trying to integrate devices of every type into HS speaking all sorts of protocols and with different mediums, that is clear. And battles whether they be Beta vs. VHS (For those that remember, the inferior product (VHS) won), or Z-Wave vs. Zigbee, or UPB vs. Insteon etc for that matter aren't necessarily the concern of the average consumer. I have read things that state Z-Wave is beating Zigbee etc and frankly it doesn't matter to me. What does matter is that I pick whichever device I want and try to integrate it with the best system for all of this mismatch equipment which is what HomeSeer does for me.

In regards to the vents, again thinking simplistically here. I am no HVAC expert and really have no qualifications for that. Again, the idea at least of the Keen Home vent is it protects the consumer from themselves. With the pressure sensor as a safety, the vent will open itself to reduce system pressure if too many vents are closed and not damage the system and allow for proper airflow levels. I do not see that feature on the EcoVent, in fact, there appear to be no sensors on the EcoVent, not even in the improved EV-200. Again the trade-off is based on the consumer's desire. I put more weight on the aesthetics and having a pressure sensor, you may put more weight on it being Z-Wave capable. Of course, I don't want to have anything wireless beyond my Wi-Fi and my Z-Wave SmartStick+ but I am willing to add a Zigbee radio to get the vent I want.

Here's some examples just on the vents alone:

EcoVent System:
https://www.ecoventsystems.com/
Sensors: Temperature, Humidity, Pressure, iBeacon
Wireless Protocols: Proprietary via Bluetooth though their Hub adds Wi-Fi and Zigbee

Keen Home System:
http://www.keenhome.io/
Sensors: Temperature, Pressure
Wireless Protocols: Zigbee, Thread, their Hub adds Lowe's Iris, SmartThings and Wink

EcoNet System:
http://www.econetcontrols.com/
Sensors: None
Wireless Protocols: Z-Wave, compatible with multiple Z-Wave Controllers.

Note that the one that HS does support (and sell) is the least smart of the 3 shown as well as the only one that doesn't support Zigbee. In contrast it could be said that the other two should support Z-Wave and I agree, however they have taken the Hub based approach to be able to access common ground for communication. This leads to the next option, if these vendors are promoting communication Hubs where common wireless protocols are combined, wouldn't it make sense then to have actual support for the "SmartThings Hub" or something of that kind instead of the Zigbee protocol directly to allow interfacing to many more items.

I too am disappointed that we are stuck in these protocol battles but the very thing that HomeSeer has done for me in the 3 or so months I have been using it is allow me access to more device types and integrate them into one unified platform than I could have imagined.

The reality is this is likely the first roadblock that HS will have presented to me which causes frustration. Many people here have had to deal with this through the years. I have owned HS for a few years but just started using it a couple of months ago. Could you imagine what the first impression experience would have been for me if I had road blocks for my UPB (Thanks Spud) or my HAI (Thanks Rob) devices. I literally would not have been able to do much of anything with it with my existing equipment. With the Z-Wave Plug-In coming along strong (Thanks HS!), I am building on all sorts of ideas, and my first impression was that this is an awesome platform. I just don't want anything to get in the way.

Thanks for listening to the rant/comment and for your time....it does look like Wink is in trouble. Funny that you posted those articles, it's hard to believe that HS won't be able to support the Keen vents, they just posted this: https://www.ecoventsystems.com/2015/07/ecovent-funding/ Even when HA goes mainstream it's still fragmented!!!!


-Travis

[jlrichar]

Travis - the options we investigated for Zigbee support were not as streamlined as we originally hoped so we've put this on hold again.

I hope you guys continue to do less (like the zigbee plugin) so that you can do more (like make it easier for someone to write a 3rd party plugin that supports zigbee).

[LeoS]

Since Philips Hue are Zigbee based and there are already a couple of HS3 plugins to control the zigbee bridge of Philips Hue, can we use that to make use of more Zigbee devices? (Sensors, switches, etc).

[mhn]

As far as I know Zigbee isn't a standard it's a chaos of more or less closed "standards".

Regards
Morten

[w.vuyk]

Since Philips Hue are Zigbee based and there are already a couple of HS3 plugins to control the zigbee bridge of Philips Hue, can we use that to make use of more Zigbee devices? (Sensors, switches, etc).

Philips did announce sensors to be included for the beginning of this year, but it has been very silent since then. Aside from sensors, you do see some other brands of lights connecting to the Hue bridge emerging, like GS, Osram and other vendors. All of which are supported by my plugin.

But I do not expect Philips will set a real standard yet for Zigbee?

Wim

[LeoS]

Philips did announce sensors to be included for the beginning of this year, but it has been very silent since then. Aside from sensors, you do see some other brands of lights connecting to the Hue bridge emerging, like GS, Osram and other vendors. All of which are supported by my plugin.

But I do not expect Philips will set a real standard yet for Zigbee?

Wim

Ahh.. In that case Philips will continue to use their current monopoly to strongarm other zigbee manufacturer to work within their ecosystem as much as possible...

[macromark]

...This leads to the next option, if these vendors are promoting communication Hubs where common wireless protocols are combined, wouldn't it make sense then to have actual support for the "SmartThings Hub" or something of that kind instead of the Zigbee protocol directly to allow interfacing to many more items.

This is what our "A2Z-Link" does for Z-Wave. It provides full Z-Wave management with a simple ASCII or JSON protocol interface! This gives companies that don't have native Z-Wave support a shortcut.

Anyway, the options we were exploring (for Zigbee) had the promise of this. Unfortunately, the connecting protocol(s) proved to be nearly as complex as Zigbee protocol itself!

It's been documented numerous times on this message board but it bears repeating here. Z-Wave is ONE protocol. Zigbee is MANY protocols. Years ago, a standard "Zigbee PRO" was introduced with the hopes of creating some interoperability between companies. Then "Zigbee Home" was introduced a bit later to focus specifically on connected home devices. Unfortunately, very few companies are working with this standard.

One ray of hope involves IFTTT. Since we have a channel, we are automatically compatible with the products, services and apps from all other channel partners. If Keen Home creates an IFTTT channel, that could provide the bridge that's needed for you.

[jlrichar]

This is not ideal: http://techcrunch.com/2015/08/07/cri...ices/?ncid=rss

[hjk]

Yeah but, you can do similar things with zwave, such as convincing a lock to join a hacker's zwave controller. Probably they would just break a window, though.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[ufd108]

It's been documented numerous times on this message board but it bears repeating here. Z-Wave is ONE protocol. Zigbee is MANY protocols. Years ago, a standard "Zigbee PRO" was introduced with the hopes of creating some interoperability between companies. Then "Zigbee Home" was introduced a bit later to focus specifically on connected home devices. Unfortunately, very few companies are working with this standard.

Hi Mark,

I am new to this board because I currently own a Vera III but I am seriously considering moving to HS3 Pro. I am an electrical engineer in the semiconductor industry and just came back from a week-long IoT (Internet of Things) conference. This was an insider conference, not open to the public, so no marketing types presenting fluff. Had sessions with representatives of many major semiconductor companies on IoT. The consensus of these companies is that the future of HA is Zigbee, WiFi, and Thread. They specifically mentioned Z-wave but said they didn't feel Z-wave would be a major player due to the fact it is sole sourced. And these are companies that deal with major players, not just small start-ups. That's why I am also looking at SmartThings vs. HS.

I know the Zigbee market is fragmented, and the software stacks are cumbersome. But a lot of work in the industry is going into cleaning that up, and the profiles are getting more support. I just think HS is going to lose out on a lot of great new products by not supporting other protocols.

I hope you reconsider the Zigbee support. Moving to HS3 Pro will be a big investment compared to Vera, and I don't want to make that investment and then have to change again in a year or two because HS doesn't support new devices that come out only in Zigbee.