Looking for a full range LED dimmer

[randy]

I've noticed that sometimes my Evolve dimmers can go lower than the HS ones. I suspect HS can alter this but one needs to understand what the LED lights want to get to very low dimming.

Darn, I really need to buy a digital scope so I can see just what is being delivered to the lights from the dimmer. I've needed one for awhile now for other projects so maybe its time to let go of some cash

We know that it can be changed with firmware because the HS-WD100+ dimmers will dim to about half the brightness with firmware v5.14 as they do with 5.17 and 5.19. That is why I rolled mine back to 5.14. Unfortunately even with 5.14 they are still a lot brighter than they were with the Cooper dimmers. With the Cooper dimmers they will get almost to off. All the dimmers are operating the same set of LEDs - about 26 MR16 and 20 GU10 lamps. Testing the lamps on a variac they will go from completely off to full without flickering. They are nonlinear, they are at about 80% brightness with 60v applied.

The dimmers do not control voltage, they modify the waveform to decrease the duty cycle.

[S-F]

We know that it can be changed with firmware because the HS-WD100+ dimmers will dim to about half the brightness with firmware v5.14 as they do with 5.17 and 5.19. That is why I rolled mine back to 5.14. Unfortunately even with 5.14 they are still a lot brighter than they were with the Cooper dimmers. With the Cooper dimmers they will get almost to off. All the dimmers are operating the same set of LEDs - about 26 MR16 and 20 GU10 lamps. Testing the lamps on a variac they will go from completely off to full without flickering. They are nonlinear, they are at about 80% brightness with 60v applied.

The dimmers do not control voltage, they modify the waveform to decrease the duty cycle.

That is fascinating! Have you put a dimmer to a scope? I wonder why all of these digital dimmers suck so badly. The number 1 reason I haven't moved to HS dimmers and LEDs is that I very frequently dim my lights to below 10% and I just don't want to deal with the hassle of testing dozens of bulbs so for now my GE dimmers are going to stay. I'm going to be running power to my shed soon though and since each switch is going to be a, well, a switch, I'm getting HS switches.

[randy]

That is fascinating! Have you put a dimmer to a scope? I wonder why all of these digital dimmers suck so badly. The number 1 reason I haven't moved to HS dimmers and LEDs is that I very frequently dim my lights to below 10% and I just don't want to deal with the hassle of testing dozens of bulbs so for now my GE dimmers are going to stay. I'm going to be running power to my shed soon though and since each switch is going to be a, well, a switch, I'm getting HS switches.

I haven't put a scope on one, though I might.

You mention GE dimmers. We have two old wall modules, the kind that plugs into a duplex outlet. They weren't even designed for LED lighting and they offer full range dimming on our LED fitted table lamps and pole lamps. The table lamps have a single 10 watt Creel LED and the pole lights have 3 Chinese 6 watt LEDs.

If we were given parameters to set the floor and start values, we could make these dimmers work with any LED. As they are they make sure they start at a high enough level to work wit almost any LED. It all could be done with firmware if the manufacturer would provide it to HS.

[Timon]

[Mountainman]

If we were given parameters to set the floor and start values, we could make these dimmers work with any LED. As they are they make sure they start at a high enough level to work wit almost any LED. It all could be done with firmware if the manufacturer would provide it to HS.

I agree with you that this would surely increase the odds it working, but I don't think that would be enough to guarantee it would work with any LED product out there. It depends on what circuit was designed inside the LED lamp. The dimmer should be able to do a leading-edge waveform modification and/or a trailing-edge modification to maximize the chances it will interoperate with the lamp. Mark at HST said the HST dimmers only do trailing-edge modification. However from reading here on the forum, trailing-edge only seems to allow it work with quite a few LED products out there.

It seems all of this needs to be adjustable by the end user as it would be difficult to automatically detect that a light is flickering and/or not dimming low enough. We need 30 parameters and an hour to set up each lamp, ha.

[randy]

I agree with you that this would surely increase the odds it working, but I don't think that would be enough to guarantee it would work with any LED product out there. It depends on what circuit was designed inside the LED lamp. The dimmer should be able to do a leading-edge waveform modification and/or a trailing-edge modification to maximize the chances it will interoperate with the lamp. Mark at HST said the HST dimmers only do trailing-edge modification. However from reading here on the forum, trailing-edge only seems to allow it work with quite a few LED products out there.

It seems all of this needs to be adjustable by the end user as it would be difficult to automatically detect that a light is flickering and/or not dimming low enough. We need 30 parameters and an hour to set up each lamp, ha.

Actually 2 parameters would solve it for any LED that can be dimmed

• Minimum dim level - this could be a value in percentage that would determine the minimum dimming level before the LED flickers or goes out.
• Minimum start level - some LEDs need to be started at a higher level than they dim to, this would set the startup level. For example, the LED might be able to dim to 1%, but might need 10% to initially start. This would assure that the dimmer goes from Off to at least 10%, then back down to the setting level if it is less than 10%. I have seen this as a fixed setting on manual dimmers.

As it is right now, many dimmers have these two things arbitrarily set. Once these settings are made, it would affect the dimmer operation whether from manual or automation control.

[Mountainman]

A third parameter would be useful. It would control how long the start level is produced before switching to the minimum dim level. If this duration is too short, the lamp may not recognize it (filter it as noise, for example). If it is too long, the lamp may produce too much light before it goes to the dim level.

A fourth parameter could select between leading/trailing edge waveform modification.