Any "commercial grade" door sensors out there? What I encounter is not reliable

[tahl]

The door/window sensors I have have never been completely reliable. I have sensors by Aeotec and I have a Ingersoll Rand sensor. They were _more_ reliable under HS2 than HS3 hence posting under the plug-in.

As an engineer, I'm confused. Why would a Z-wave sensor _ever_ not report an open window (or closed) if the protocol has handshaking? I have sensors 5 feet from a repeating module and I'm missing window openings about half the time. That window's sensor has been replaced 3 times with two different brands and fresh batteries inserted. Same deal.

So questions:
1) Any way to extend the retries or timeout for a particular sensor with regard to z-wave controller? (Repeater already nearby.)
2) I have polling turned _on_ and wakeup set at 50 minutes ... why is Dev Mgr reporting an update like every 24 hours -- if that?
3) Any brands/models of door sensors that are for more serious / commercial applications?
4) Is Z-wave, like X-10, just inherently unsuitable for this task?

Thanks for any inputs!
Tahl

Current Date/Time: 9/19/2017 1:48:42 PM
HomeSeer Version: HS3 Pro Edition 3.0.0.357
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro - Work Station
System Uptime: 9 Days 21 Hours 6 Minutes 13 Seconds
IP Address: 192.168.168.11
Number of Devices: 190
Number of Events: 37
Available Threads: 1200

Enabled Plug-Ins
3.0.0.29: ADIO-100
3.0.6.22: Insteon
3.0.1.130: Z-Wave

[Pete]

Here never played with ZWave door sensors. Only with Zigbee door sensors.

The Zigbee sensors worked as well as can be expected.

The X10 wireless works too but it is much more reasonably priced these days.

BUT not even close to my wired and wireless alarm panel sensors.

[tahl]

Here never played with ZWave door sensors. Only with Zigbee door sensors.

The Zigbee sensors worked as well as can be expected.

The X10 wireless works too but it is much more reasonably priced these days.

BUT not even close to my wired and wireless alarm panel sensors.

@pete,

Couple of Qs:
1) "Zigbee sensors work as well as can be expected" means they sort of work? 90% of the time? Etc.
2) "Wireless alarm panel sensors" ... what do you use? Works better than the Zigbee?

Thanks,
Tahl

[Pete]

1) "Zigbee sensors work as well as can be expected" means they sort of work? 90% of the time? Etc.

They work, they are slow and the batteries on my devices lasted less than one year.

2) "Wireless alarm panel sensors" ... what do you use? Works better than the Zigbee?

I have used the wireless sensors sold by HAI and generic wireless alarm sensors. They work and are faster than Z-Wave or Zigbee sensors and their batteries last a lot longer.

Connected but not really utilized for my Leviton HAI Omni Pro 2 alarm panel I have:

1 - Leviton HAI Wireless Receiver For GE InterLogix - 42A00-2
2 - Leviton 45A00-1 64-Zone Wireless Receiver

[Rvtravlr]

I have had great response and battery life from Ecolink motion sensors.


https://www.amazon.com/Z-wave-Instal...irzwave2.5-eco

[mwolter]

I’ve had great luck with these zwave door and motion sensors. http://www.homedepot.com/p/2GIG-Tech...1KIT/205785795. Never missed an event that I am aware of.

Relatively inexpensive and the batteries last quite a long time. On the motion sensors, be sure to turn off polling on the child devices or motion will be delayed about a second or two.

[racerfern]

http://www.homedepot.com/p/2GIG-Tech...1KIT/205785795. Never missed an event that I am aware of.

Agreed, it's a Nortek/Linear/GoControl product that works quite well. Look for other names and prices might vary. Excellent battery life too.

[Pete]

@tahl

Homeseer is not alarm software.

You can do anything you want with the software. That is what makes Homeseer great automation software.

License agreement states:

10. HOMESEER SOFTWARE IS NOT INTENDED FOR USE IN THE OPERATION OF NUCLEAR FACILITIES, AIRCRAFT NAVIGATION OR COMMUNICATION SYSTEMS, AIR TRAFFIC CONTROL SYSTEMS, LIFE SUPPORT MACHINES OR OTHER EQUIPMENT IN WHICH THE FAILURE OF THE SOFTWARE COULD LEAD TO DEATH, PERSONAL INJURY, OR SEVERE PHYSICAL OR ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE.


In 2016 UL approved the latest Z-Wave protocol for UL 1023 compliance, a game-changer in the security space of home automation.

I am automation old fashion here with the preference of utilizing a wire before wireless. That is me.

Here have utilized CS services now for some 15 years with current Leviton OmniPro 2 alarm panel. Never have had an issue.

My Homeseer 3 connects to X10, UPB, Z-Wave while the OmniPro 2 panel connects to X10, UPB, Z-Wave and Zigbee.

There is no best protocol as each one has nuances mostly because it is evolving and continues to evolve. Really it comes down to what company has the largest advertising budget.

I like to tinker a bit and have been playing with the Amazon Echo, Smartthings Hub, Almond +, et al such that here there is the never touched automation and the tinkering automation. Security though is never touched as it works just fine for me. (autonomous CCTV/NVR and alarm panel).

[Teken]

If security is truly important to the OP. The only tried and true method to monitor any zone is via hard wiring. People are expecting too much from hobby protocols (Insteon, Z-Wave, ZigBee, UPB, X-10, WiFi, BLE) no matter how many years on the market.

Serious people invest the time and resources to do it right the first go round and that is via hard wiring.

Wireless by its very nature is insecure and unreliable no matter the frequency / technology used.

When you add in the human element of *I'll get around to it* to investing in the correct primary cells, having spares on hand, never mind testing them on a monthly basis.

99.999999% of the people fail to ever complete these simple yet important tasks!

I can literally count on one hand how many people who have completed a quarterly walk test. Never mind completing a proper live load test on their security alarm system.

Seeing someone pull out a battery and complete a carbon load test based on a 20 amp hr rating ~ literally I haven't seen / read by any consumer.

If the protection of your family and home is of the prime importance. Please consider hiring someone to pull the required wires for those zones.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Pete]

The realm of security / security panels is changing any how.

Many companies just put life and safety disclaimers (legalize small print) to protect themselves.

Think about the resilience of the old copper telephone line and compare it today to using a television cable that was never meant to be a lifeline (and is being used as a lifeline).

[tahl]

@tahl

Homeseer is not alarm software.

You can do anything you want with the software. That is what makes Homeseer great automation software.

License agreement states:

10. HOMESEER SOFTWARE IS NOT INTENDED FOR USE IN THE OPERATION OF NUCLEAR FACILITIES, AIRCRAFT NAVIGATION OR COMMUNICATION SYSTEMS, AIR TRAFFIC CONTROL SYSTEMS, LIFE SUPPORT MACHINES OR OTHER EQUIPMENT IN WHICH THE FAILURE OF THE SOFTWARE COULD LEAD TO DEATH, PERSONAL INJURY, OR SEVERE PHYSICAL OR ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE.


In 2016 UL approved the latest Z-Wave protocol for UL 1023 compliance, a game-changer in the security space of home automation.

I am automation old fashion here with the preference of utilizing a wire before wireless. That is me.

Here have utilized CS services now for some 15 years with current Leviton OmniPro 2 alarm panel. Never have had an issue.

My Homeseer 3 connects to X10, UPB, Z-Wave while the OmniPro 2 panel connects to X10, UPB, Z-Wave and Zigbee.

There is no best protocol as each one has nuances mostly because it is evolving and continues to evolve. Really it comes down to what company has the largest advertising budget.

I like to tinker a bit and have been playing with the Amazon Echo, Smartthings Hub, Almond +, et al such that here there is the never touched automation and the tinkering automation. Security though is never touched as it works just fine for me. (autonomous CCTV/NVR and alarm panel).

@pete

I agree that hardwire is the way to go for super serious applications like medical devices and life-safety. I'm just trying to get past "hobbyist-grade" to "professional-grade". I have one window that has an abysmal accuracy record. Like 70%. That's not even hobbyist-grade and is unacceptable level of accuracy. It's 2017 and home automation technology has to be reliable.

I need to think of something else.

Best,
Tahl

[Pete]

It's 2017 and home automation technology has to be reliable.

My lightning automation is 100% accurate from Homeseer 3 and my Leviton OmniPro 2.

What do you see or envision automation as?

What do you want to work relating to automation that isn't working?

Wireless sensors that are Zigbee, ZWave or GE Interlogix work as well as can be expected from RF / battery operated devices.

This stuff is really is not even close to a wired sensor. That is just the way it is today with wireless.

What makes wireless sensors popular is the fact that it is wireless not that it is 100% accurate.

Here utilize both wall mounted PIRs and ceiling mounted PIRs (Rokonets) and it still sucks relating to occupancy.

RFID / tagged vehicles do well.

Well too automation is not security.

That said I have used wired security sensors to automate since the early 2000's.

Tried the follow me automation with wife and she did not like it at all. Early touchscreens here were enabled via PIR sensors in the room.

[jrfuda]

I too have tried several different brands of wireless z-wave sensors. They are very inconsistent.

I had a recessed Aeotech door sensor that worked great, but died after 8 months. I replaced it with an identical monoprice "no-name" version, which has worked OK for a year - 1 or 2 false positives... which are too much for it to be considered OK to use for real security unless 1 or 2 false alarms per door each year are OK.

I have two no-name monorprice door window sensors that I ordered at the same time, which look identical inside and out, but registered differently in homeseer (one of them has the open/close reversed with the tamper). One of them gives me several false positives a day, the other maybe 1 or 2 a year. Again - this is no good.

That said, the 12+ wireless sensors that came with my monitored security system (sensors are Honeywell, I think) have worked 100% perfectly and have used the same batteries for over 7 years. The only exception is a glass break sensor that is on my garage ceiling that stopped working after the roof leaked and it got wet. It worked again after I cleaned it a replaced the battery - I think the battery was the only thing that was really damaged.

I don't understand why this old tech works so well but Zwave et al does not. I will eventually get rid of my monitoring company's panel and have my own that Homeseer can connect to - for informational purposes only so I can take advantage of the 30 odd wired and 12+ wireless zones that the current panel monitors.

[Pete]

The purchased for alarm panel wireless sensors (like GE Interlogix) were developed / mfg for commercial alarm panels by the commercial alarm industry. I used some of the wireless stuff in the 1980's. Today utilize both proprietary Leviton HAI and common GE Interlogix stuff with two separate receivers on my OmniPro 2 panel. That said left it connected with only 1-2 wireless sensors as the majority (99%) of my sensors are wired to the alarm panel.

There has been major lobbying efforts to approve ZWave / Zigbee wireless devices for security purposes (including smoke detectors) by large ISPs with big money buckets.

Just had a relative install the Comcast system. One touchscreen and wireless door sensors and multiple wireless PIRs. The ISP now offers a combo package of Internet, TV, Telephone and home security/automation (even CCTV) for a very good 1st year price with a 2 year contract. I am not sure but assume that all of it is leased at a monthly rate rather than owned.

The home alarm / security industry as a whole is changing logarithmically these days and mostly going to the cloud by large and small players in the industry.

The DIY security and self monitoring is also being pushed as a low cost alternative which is in contradiction to the old standards of home security relating to life and safety.

[ITguyHS]

Have you considered using a commercial-grade wired alarm switch (magnetic, push-button, whatever you like) and connecting the wires to something like the below that could be mounted either on the door frame or remotely if you didn't mind running wire? You'd use the terminals in the Ecolink instead of using the magnet that comes with it.
https://www.amazon.com/Ecolink-Intel...nk+door+sensor