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  #41  
Old August 8th, 2017, 12:24 PM
msbreton msbreton is offline
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I have 1 iPad mini mounted on the wall. This is the primary alarm interface (as well as all other house controls) and includes status for all the door/window sensors, locks, alarm status, arm, disarm, and panic functions. Additionally, at each door I have an Insteon 6 button switch that controls the door light as well as buttons for Arm Away, Arm Stay, Panic, and All Lights on. Disarm is normally done when unlocking the door via the z-wave based Kwikset locks. If you can unlock the door, the alarm will disarm (for primary users). So, normally you don't have to work to the iPad to disarm on entry. Just for disarm from Arm Stay mode.
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  #42  
Old August 8th, 2017, 05:05 PM
paul paul is offline
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That makes sense, and gives me things to think about. Many thanks!

Paul
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  #43  
Old August 12th, 2017, 06:13 PM
dexterdom dexterdom is offline
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I love techie projects as much as the next guy, but when it comes to my security system I want rock-solid reliability. A DSC 64 zone panel is dirt cheap and works well with wired and wireless sensors.
Add an envisalink board and you have full HS3 integration.
Patching together a security system with a hodgepodge of general purpose devices (PCs, ipads, rpis, etc) is not a good idea IMHO. I use Insteon extensively in my home but there's no way I'm trusting it as an alarm system.
Cheers!
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  #44  
Old September 17th, 2017, 10:19 PM
Ltek Ltek is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dexterdom View Post
I love techie projects as much as the next guy, but when it comes to my security system I want rock-solid reliability. A DSC 64 zone panel is dirt cheap and works well with wired and wireless sensors.
Add an envisalink board and you have full HS3 integration.
Patching together a security system with a hodgepodge of general purpose devices (PCs, ipads, rpis, etc) is not a good idea IMHO. I use Insteon extensively in my home but there's no way I'm trusting it as an alarm system.
Cheers!
ditto
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  #45  
Old September 17th, 2017, 10:42 PM
paul paul is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dexterdom View Post
I love techie projects as much as the next guy, but when it comes to my security system I want rock-solid reliability. A DSC 64 zone panel is dirt cheap and works well with wired and wireless sensors.
Add an envisalink board and you have full HS3 integration.
Patching together a security system with a hodgepodge of general purpose devices (PCs, ipads, rpis, etc) is not a good idea IMHO. I use Insteon extensively in my home but there's no way I'm trusting it as an alarm system.
Cheers!
On one hand I agree. But then again on the other hand, it's making an assumption that the security system is the be-all line of defence to make sure your house is safe, which really isn't the case. It's an additional line of defence, for sure, but if someone really wants to get into your house, they're going to get in, alarm or not. It's a deterrent to make it less likely someone will do so.

That being the case, I think I'll likely go for flexibility, features, and working the way I want it to. I went back and forth a few times on this, but I think this is where I'm coming to.
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  #46  
Old September 18th, 2017, 12:28 AM
Ltek Ltek is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul View Post
On one hand I agree. But then again on the other hand, it's making an assumption that the security system is the be-all line of defence to make sure your house is safe, which really isn't the case. It's an additional line of defence, for sure, but if someone really wants to get into your house, they're going to get in, alarm or not. It's a deterrent to make it less likely someone will do so.

That being the case, I think I'll likely go for flexibility, features, and working the way I want it to. I went back and forth a few times on this, but I think this is where I'm coming to.
No one made the assumption you concluded we did... We simply stated a traditional Alarm System (Ademco/Vista, DSC, etc) are more reliable. They are - in many ways. If you don't understand that, or believe it, then the discussion is not going to matter. I use my Ademco integrated with my Homeseer (with Zwave devices) and have the best of both worlds - and quite a bit of redundancy.

Do what you want, you asked for an opinion and we provided one. Many of us have years (I have over 20) experience in HA and security trying many different systems and methods.
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  #47  
Old September 18th, 2017, 12:44 AM
paul paul is offline
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Originally Posted by Ltek View Post
No one made the assumption you concluded we did... We simply stated a traditional Alarm System (Ademco/Vista, DSC, etc) are more reliable. They are - in many ways. If you don't understand that, or believe it, then the discussion is not going to matter. I use my Ademco integrated with my Homeseer (with Zwave devices) and have the best of both worlds - and quite a bit of redundancy.

Do what you want, you asked for an opinion and we provided one. Many of us have years (I have over 20) experience in HA and security trying many different systems and methods.
It sounds like I offended - not my intention, looking back at the wording of my message I can see how that would be construed. My apologies for that.

Basically what I was trying to say was that, after listing to what everyone has had to say (and appreciative of people's input), and after going back and forth on what works best for me several times, I think I'm coming to deciding that for me just letting Homeseer do the work, works for me....
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  #48  
Old September 18th, 2017, 12:49 AM
Ltek Ltek is offline
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Originally Posted by paul View Post
It sounds like I offended - not my intention, looking back at the wording of my message I can see how that would be construed. My apologies for that.

Basically what I was trying to say was that, after listing to what everyone has had to say (and appreciative of people's input), and after going back and forth on what works best for me several times, I think I'm coming to deciding that for me just letting Homeseer do the work, works for me....
I'm not offended, just clarifying our point on automation systems vs security systems. If HS works how you want to handle security, that is fine - as long as you are aware it is not designed to be an actual security system, and the reliability benchmark for a security system is far higher. Nothing is perfect, but if you want a real security system, you should get one - they are not expensive.
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  #49  
Old September 18th, 2017, 11:55 AM
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Pete Pete is offline
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Here DIY'd the installation of security panel(s) (Leviton Omni Pro 2).

One panel's wiring was done one wire at a time. Some connections took all day such that it was a bit of a project. Another home the GC subcontracted an alarm installation company and they put in all of the alarm wires. I moved the alarm panel closet in the drawings to a centrally located wiring closet. The alarm company just left a company sticker where the wires were and labeled all of the wires. They did not terminate any of the wires. Every door and window and PIR and console location was wired. I contacted the alarm company for a quote to put in a panel. The quote for installation was around ~$5,000 USD. This was when I decided to DIY my alarm panel installation. I did not terminate and connect everything to the panel in one day. Rather it was a few days whenever I had time. It was much easier than running wires post build.

Relating to life and saftey features the panel does connect to central services monitoring. The keypads / Omnitouch screens / consoles are wired directly to the panel. I have also run the Leviton Omni Pro software on wireless tablets (and it does work). I prefer though not to depend on the wireless tablets when the consoles work fine for me. The panel works fine this way.

I have integrated security with automation but have not put dependencies of software automation on security. (life and saftey stuff). That is me though.



Homeseer works with the panel. The panel has no security dependencies on Homeseer. Homeseer does add more features to the base right now. Via Homeseer add CCTV stuff and email stuff (triggers and events). Homeseer though does not shut off or turn on the alarm. The alarm events though trigger customized TTS and Homeseer stuff.
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Last edited by Pete; September 18th, 2017 at 01:55 PM.
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  #50  
Old September 18th, 2017, 01:02 PM
paul paul is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete View Post
Homeseer works with the panel. The panel has no security dependencies on Homeseer. Homeseer does add more features to the base right now. Via Homeseer add CCTV stuff and email stuff (triggers and events). Homeseer though does not shut off or turn on the alarm. The alarm events though trigger customized TTS and Homeseer stuff.
When you say homeseer does not shut off or turn on the alarm, are you saying you haven't configured it to do so, or it is not able to do so?

regards,

Paul
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  #51  
Old September 18th, 2017, 02:01 PM
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Pete Pete is offline
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I have not configured Homeseer to turn on and off the alarm. I have left that to the OmniPro keypads and consoles.

I can turn on and off the alarm with HSTouch / Omni Plugin.

I also run OmniPro touch soft on some of my Jogglers.

Wife has used the Leviton HAI consoles now for some 15 years. We are both older these days.

She has always been afraid of my HS Touch screens.

I just removed the Amazon Echo from the master bathroom. I had asked her to speak to Alex. She did, got spooked and asked that I remove it and I did.

It would a traumatic experience for her to switch and her trauma would be my trauma.
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  #52  
Old September 18th, 2017, 02:01 PM
Teken Teken is offline
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I will truly never understand why people insist upon taking something that was never intended to do X to perform Y?!? I could see if a person had absolutely nothing in terms of finances or the common sense.

But this isn't the case here, its the concerted effort to use something that isn't going to offer the service you expect. Never mind the device isn't UL /cUL certified to do so, offers no method to detect a fault, can't be hooked up directly to be monitored by a CS, never mind they would never allow it.

Offers no redundancy, fault tolerances, and you still don't get a discount from your home insurance company??

As soon as I read someone is going to kludge a pieces of hardware like a RPi or some other toy like product I just shake my head and close my eyes!

Its safe to say regardless of all the bells and whistles in any alarm system. Force protection is the only thing that will offer you the most valuable thing you need when a break in is under way.

That's time . . .

There are four rings of security and 99.9999999999% of the population only think about the noise makers. There has never been a noise maker in the history of alarm systems that has ever stopped an intruder from breaking into a structure, none.

The first step in any security *System* is completing a audit where it identifies the threats and weaknesses in the home, people, and environment. I can count on one hand how many people I have ever met in real life that has ever completed a comprehensive threat assessment of their lives.

Security isn't a thing ~ Its a lifestyle
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  #53  
Old September 18th, 2017, 02:41 PM
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Pete Pete is offline
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It doesn't matter these days with the use of "security" in cloud connected automation hubs these days.

Thinking that there is a disclosure of using it except in terms of a life safety issue.
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  #54  
Old September 18th, 2017, 02:44 PM
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rmasonjr rmasonjr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teken View Post
There has never been a noise maker in the history of alarm systems that has ever stopped an intruder from breaking into a structure, none.
Really??
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  #55  
Old September 18th, 2017, 03:15 PM
Teken Teken is offline
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Originally Posted by rmasonjr View Post
Really??
Yes, really.

No amount of noise or lights will stop a physical intrusion, none. Can a siren stop a person form kicking down a door? Can a strobe light stop a window from being smashed in? Can any of the sensors from infrared, microwave, infrasonic, ultra sonic, weight displacement, piezeo, laser, stop a person from entering a premises?

None . . .

The only thing that can offer you that precious element of *Time* is force protection elements. Whether it be security gates, fortified doors, hinges, jambs, window bars, bullet proof / hurricane rated windows & doors, etc.

A 85 dripping wet boy can kick down and breach a common door in under 15 seconds and be on top of you in another 30 seconds slapping you in the face with said wet dripping sneaker.

Imagine, someone of average size and build say 5'9" 175 lbs.

A certified and monitored security system is only one of the four elements in the ring of security. Why would anyone expect to be protected by Hodge podge of scraps glued together as a second thought?

This is like watching someone using a some random heavy object pounding away with a screw driver thinking the two items are the correct tool for impact work. That thing that was created thousands of years called a hammer, mallet, dead blow, etc. Along with a impact chisel et all would be the correct tools.

Along with safety glass's and gloves . . .

All of this is right up there with people who truly believe they can do better (self monitoring) than a certified CS in monitoring their homes and property. They believe they have the resources and human stamina to be awake and be available to react to any of the following 24.7.365: Flood, Fire, Break In, Low Temp, etc?

These people who self monitor don't have to sleep?

What are they going to do when that SMS, Text, Email, Phone call doesn't reach them because they are in a under ground garage, at the mall, on vacation 9999999999999 miles away?

Are they going to call Bob next door who so happens to be at bingo every Sunday with the Miss's?
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  #56  
Old September 18th, 2017, 03:19 PM
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rmasonjr rmasonjr is offline
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Originally Posted by Teken View Post
Yes, really.

No amount of noise or lights will stop a physical intrusion, none. Can a siren stop a person form kicking down a door? Can a strobe light stop a window from being smashed in? Can any of the sensors from infrared, microwave, infrasonic, ultra sonic, weight displacement, piezeo, laser, stop a person from entering a premises?

None . . .
Found one:
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  #57  
Old September 18th, 2017, 03:26 PM
Teken Teken is offline
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Originally Posted by rmasonjr View Post
Found one:
You obviously missed the point of what I offered. Besides the fact the video you provided comes off as a cheap advert for a company. If you believe a everyday smash and grab, day light home invasion, is going to be stopped by a siren and lights.

You haven't traveled the world or been exposed to real world events that happen literally every day in this world. A junky doesn't care about lights and noise only that they can obtain something of value to be sold and pawned off for their next fix.

A thug down on his luck which there are many in this world aren't concerned about a siren or lights when they know with high confidence that a police officer won't be attending said break in from hours to days after the fact.

Those are the facts . . .

Anyone who lives in a gated community or those who subscribe to security patrol services are the rare instances.

Next . . .
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  #58  
Old September 18th, 2017, 03:29 PM
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rmasonjr rmasonjr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teken View Post
You obviously missed the point of what I offered. Besides the fact the video you provided comes off as a cheap advert for a company. If you believe a everyday smash and grab, day light home invasion, is going to be stopped by a siren and lights.

You haven't traveled the world or been exposed to real world events that happen literally every day in this world. A junky doesn't care about lights and noise only that they can obtain something of value to be sold and pawned off for their next fix.

A thug down on his luck which there are many in this world aren't concerned about a siren or lights when they know with high confidence that a police officer won't be attending said break in from hours to days after the fact.

Those are the facts . . .

Anyone who lives in a gated community or those who subscribe to security patrol services are the rare instances.

Next . . .
Ok... Thanks...
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  #59  
Old October 11th, 2017, 04:20 PM
balpaugh balpaugh is offline
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I've thought about using an iPad as a console screen near the door, but I'm concentered about connectivity. Often when I connect with my iPhone, it can take a while for it to reconnect or I have to kill the HSTouch app and restart it for it to respond. I was wondering if you run into the same issues or how your iPad responds to a wake up?
Thank you.
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  #60  
Old October 11th, 2017, 04:23 PM
paul paul is offline
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Originally Posted by balpaugh View Post
I've thought about using an iPad as a console screen near the door, but I'm concentered about connectivity. Often when I connect with my iPhone, it can take a while for it to reconnect or I have to kill the HSTouch app and restart it for it to respond. I was wondering if you run into the same issues or how your iPad responds to a wake up?
Thank you.
I have run into those same issues with my apple devices (it's an ongoing issue for me on another thread on the board), The main issue I've had is long delay in getting connectivity after a reconnection. However that only seems to be when I go away from teh app and come back to it.

For a panel on the wall, my plan is going to be to not have the ipad go to sleep ever. I'll set hs3touch to switch to a black screen after a certain period of time, but the wake up will be within hs3touch rather than having the device actually go to sleep...
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