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    I'm thinking about UPB

    Here we go again,

    I am convinced I have maxed out my system with X10. After looking at all the other protocols, and from what I have read UPB looks to be my best bet. There is no way I can do it all at once, so one room at a time. My overall layout of each room is 2 (or more) can lights and a ceiling fan. Each light has its own module (in a junction box in the attic) and an 8 button keypad where the light switch used to be. The first 4 buttons (generally) each can light, all lights and fan with the remaining buttons controlling other lights in the house. So i am assuming that thru events I could still have the remaining buttons control X10 devices until each room is changed over? is that correct? What is the general consenses of the Simply Automated products?

    The wife is going to kill me....
    Over The Hill
    What Hill?
    Where?
    When?
    I Don't Remember Any Hill

    Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

    #2
    I curious as to why UPB and not Z-Wave? The delay on UPB light switches drive me crazy and the lack of new "stuff" makes me wonder who's jumping on the UPB band wagon.
    💁‍♂️ Support & Customer Service 🙋‍♂️ Sales Questions 🛒 Shop HomeSeer Products

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      #3
      All of your suppositions are correct regarding events. I have about 85 or 90 UPB devices, and the vast majority of those are Simply Automated---I have not had a failure of any of the devices. The only non-SA devices I have are things not made by SA --- I have some HAI keypads (because I wanted the LED's on the buttons); and some high capacity 1500W switches. Everything else is SA.

      Pete

      Comment


        #4
        I'd recommend UPB to anyone. I've been using it at work for almost 2 years and just about a year at home. At work we're generally interfacing them to HAI OmniPro2's but at home i use HS. So far between work and home I've had one switch that was bad in the box and was replaced by the distributer, other than that no failures at all. I did have one house on the large side, over 7000sqf, that i had to use 2 phase couplers in. I've found that
        The only problem i have with UPB is there are so many choices on how to do things, HS events, UPB links, Presets, combinations, etc. When i wired my house initially it all the switches were either in the attic or the basement with each room having at least one 8 button keypad. I've kept that same scheme up with UPB, even though using links makes that not near as necessary.

        Originally posted by Rupp View Post
        I curious as to why UPB and not Z-Wave? The delay on UPB light switches drive me crazy and the lack of new "stuff" makes me wonder who's jumping on the UPB band wagon.

        What delay, i can't say I've noticed that at all. If you're getting a delay then something is not quite right with the setup or you've left the default settings in the switch during setup. BTW the UPB 3in2out I/O modules are excellant. I used one to replace 3 powerflashes, and 2 X10 controlled relays for low voltage switching.
        Marty
        ------
        XPpro SP3 /w HS Standard 2.5.0.80, HSTouch Server - 1.0.0.70, HSTouch Client 1.0.0.73 HSTouch Android - 1.0.0.2, HSTouch iPhone - 1.0.0.2
        Playing with HS3 a bit but it's just play at this point.

        Comment


          #5
          Rupp, I have 14 Z-Wave dimmers, and they work well but I am concerned because they are all in one end of the house and all close together, I guess if I started upgrading at that end of the house I should be ok, but I wanted to start at the other end since that is where the few issues I have are. My house is "L" shaped with outside edge dimensions of 87' by 42'. The other issue is it won't be a short term changeout ( rough count of current x10 is 24 keypads, 45 fixture modules and (dimming and relays) and 8 switchlincs (dimming and relays)) and I probably won't eliminate x10 entirely so that will mean more workaround scripts. There are Simply Automated 8 button keypads cheaper than the Z-wave and I currently have 24 keypadlinc 8's, so cost will play a big part in it as well.

          What is the typical RF range of Z-Wave devices, counting wall and furniture and the like? currently all 14 of my zwave are about 10' from my Z-troller, the next hop would be 15' from the closest current z-wave
          Over The Hill
          What Hill?
          Where?
          When?
          I Don't Remember Any Hill

          Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

          Comment


            #6
            Here is an example, this is only keypads and the garage is detached 20' away and has 3 keypads

            Legend
            Red Z= Zwave
            Blue K= X10 keypadlinc 8's
            Blue ZT =Ztroller
            Attached Files
            Over The Hill
            What Hill?
            Where?
            When?
            I Don't Remember Any Hill

            Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

            Comment


              #7
              Also one other IMPORTANT question, How is UPB's insensitivity to lightning (thunderstorms) July August and September we have a thunderstorm every single day, its called our Monsoon season. Twice already this year I have had to reprogram a few keypadlincs (they default back to A1-A8) I have a Leviton whole house surge protector on my main panel and one on my subpanel, but if the lightning gets close I can almost guarantee at least one keypadlinc will lose its mind
              Over The Hill
              What Hill?
              Where?
              When?
              I Don't Remember Any Hill

              Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

              Comment


                #8
                i recently began switching over to upb from x10, cause i was maxed out as well. i love upb! don't know much about zwave, but i think upb is great.
                Plugins:
                BLLogMonitor, BLGarbage, BLBackup, BLOutGoingCalls, BLUps, BLRfid, JvEss, DooMotion, Applied Digital Ocelot, AC RF Processor, UltraMon, PJC AVR 430, UPB, Rain8net, DSC Panel, JRiver Media center, Windows Media Player, SageMediaCenter, SnevlCID, MCSTemperature.

                Comment


                  #9
                  i've had plenty of power-outages due to the storms in texas over the past couple of months, and none of my UPB devices have ever needed reprogramming. in fact, the only problem i've ever had is powerline noise, but it seems i'm one of only two or three people that have seen it as severe as i have.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I love UPB also...

                    I love UPB also and I am still having a power line noise problem but only on one circuit.
                    James

                    Running HS 3 on Win10 .

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by DeLicious View Post
                      i've had plenty of power-outages due to the storms in texas over the past couple of months, and none of my UPB devices have ever needed reprogramming. in fact, the only problem i've ever had is powerline noise, but it seems i'm one of only two or three people that have seen it as severe as i have.
                      Well I am in northern arizona, so we get the same type storms infact we just had about a 15 minute power outage, boy I love my generator If the power just goes out I don't have a problem, it is when it drops momentarily (or surges)

                      So now about this noise issue? What was the cause, do they make filters? I would imagine the same type issues that plague X10? (I could almost be called a noise expert after the many years of tracking x10 noise and signal suck...)

                      jasv, if it is just one circuit, have you tried all the x10 secrets? like checking the seating of that breaker, making sure the screw is tight on that breaker, checking all the recepticles on that circuit (especially if you have the ones where the wire just pushes into the back instead of being wrapped around the screw?)

                      Where do you guys buy your product (best prices and selection)

                      Since I am still weighing all options....

                      Rupp any brand Zwave to stay away from? any comments on my floor plan as far as a reliable network?
                      Over The Hill
                      What Hill?
                      Where?
                      When?
                      I Don't Remember Any Hill

                      Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

                      Comment


                        #12
                        I have about 48 UBP switches, and it works great. The Simply Automated switches are great and flexible. I wouldn't, however, use the Simply Automated in-line modules.

                        UPB is not perfect, but its about as close as you can get with what's out there. Even the delay which Rupp mentions, which never really bothered me, has been addressed in new devices, and now the delay can be reduced, if it bothers you. I haven't had one fully bad switch yet, but I did have one with a marginal receiver, and I replaced it.

                        UPB is great because the system can do a bunch without any automation controller. This is great for reliability, because if you design it correctly, the UPB network can provide some redundancy to a HA controller.

                        The only negative, is that switch manufacturers haven't standardized their LED colors so you can have any pair of colors between blue, green and red. Stick with one switch type and you'll be all set. Also, don't EVERY buy a "remote switch." They are junk and you don't need them anyway.

                        UPB is more about signal-to-noise ratio then noise. Get a good signal and noise will never be a problem. X-10 noise filters work for UPB should you need that. I haven't.

                        One warning, is that UPB probably won't work when you use a generator. You won't damage switches, but unless you have a very clean sinewave, it probably won't work either.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by jackpod View Post

                          So now about this noise issue? What was the cause, do they make filters? I would imagine the same type issues that plague X10? (I could almost be called a noise expert after the many years of tracking x10 noise and signal suck...)
                          My noise issue is enigmatic, at best. I have no idea where it's coming from, but I have half an idea that it is from outside the house. Also, it is on both phases, and is so severe that it sends the UpStart noise meter to its highest level, preventing all communications, even on the same phase. I talked to Brad at Simply Automated this week, and he said they are preparing to release 5A and 15A plug-in filters, but were just awaiting UL approval. Nobody makes a whole-house filter to prevent outside signals from coming into the house, but Brad suggested a non-inverting phase coupler (as opposed to the inverting couplers that SA offers) would attenuate the cross-phase noise. I have yet to try it out, so I can't offer any first-hand experience on that.

                          Originally posted by jackpod View Post

                          jasv, if it is just one circuit, have you tried all the x10 secrets? like checking the seating of that breaker, making sure the screw is tight on that breaker, checking all the recepticles on that circuit (especially if you have the ones where the wire just pushes into the back instead of being wrapped around the screw?)
                          the #1 solution i've read both here and on cocoontech for fixing UPB noise (and signal strength problems) is always tightening the screws on the breaker. I just had the panel installed a year ago, and my signal is strong on both phases, so I don't think I have any problems with that. Plus, my noise issue is typically once every two weeks for just a couple of hours, usually late at night, so maybe it's something the neighbors are turning on.

                          [/quote]

                          Originally posted by jackpod View Post
                          Where do you guys buy your product (best prices and selection)

                          Automated Outlet, and nowhere else... best prices, best service, and a great bunch of guys.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Anogee, I have a quality generator, 15kw, 3600rpm but it isn't a full sinewave. My computers don't mind, nor does my av equipment but I have put a scope on it. I guess I should get a switch and see what happens on generator....

                            Delicious,

                            I would check that panel, especially being new. the expansion and contraction on a new screw connection is greater than one that has been retightened. When I install my service disconnect / transfer switch (using 00 wire) I got about 3/4 turn on it 1 year later
                            Over The Hill
                            What Hill?
                            Where?
                            When?
                            I Don't Remember Any Hill

                            Virtualized Server 2k3 Ent X86 Guest on VMWare ESXi 4.1 with 3 SunRay thin clients as access points - HSPro 2.4.0.48 - ZTroller - ACRF2 (3 WGL 800's) - iAutomate RFID - Ledam - MLHSPlugin - Ultra1wire - RainRelay8 - TI103 - Ultramon - WAF-AB8SS - jvESS (11 zones) - Bitwise Controls BC4 - with 745 Total Devices - 550 Events - 104 scripts - 78 ZWave devices - 42 X10 devices - 76 DS10a's 3 RFXSenors and 32 Motion Sensors

                            Comment


                              #15
                              i'll be more than happy to check... it's a good idea. except i'm ignorant as to how. could someone provide detailed instructions to tighten screws in my breaker box?

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