Wondering if there is any interest.

[Rupp]

I'm working on a VB application that will allow you to select files to back up. I'm going to add an option to shut down HS do a back up and then restart HS. Here is a form I hacked together tonight and welcome comments and suggestions. I was going to base it on Winzip but that requires winzip and many have it but other haven't bought it. As more and more users start using XP winzip is becoming less prominent with the built in XP compresses folders. So I chose to implement this backup using a winzip like dll. It's called zipfldr.dll and is simply placed in the windows/system32 directory. Here's a screen shot and let me know what you guys think. TIA

[Tom Kern]

Rupp,

I think its a great idea. Everyone should be backing up their Homeseer folder and many are not. I use Winzip as well. Would the compression ratios be similar to winzip? My HS folder is roughly 415 megs and I zip all but my ultralog mdb which is worth around 145 megs. This leaves 270 megs that compresses down to around 90 or so. Actually, I didn't clear my temp directory before I did the properties for the 415 megs, so its probably smaller than that. You would want to clear temp before backup.

[beach]

Of course we are interested. I just installed the rotating backup script with the special program written to automatically close winzip when there are errors. It works, but I would rather have homeseer shut down and backup properly just in case. Thank you Rupp.

[johnwpb]

Shutting down HomeSeer

I love the idea of a backup utility for HS. I am on the other hand not to keen on shutting down HS every time it does a backup. I like HS to run my automated tasks, and not be shut down to do one.

As a side effect, having the system reporting the "up time" of less than 24 hours all the time dosent appeal to me.

With the size of my HS dir, it takes around 10 minutes to complete a backup. A lot can happen in that 10 minutes that I may need to have HS running. As there are 3 people in the house on totally different schedules. There really isn't a "Good time" for us not to have HS running. This holds especially true for opening and closing the garage, HSP, the security system, Climate control and other "critical" systems. Even for smaller tasks as turning on the bathroom light when motion is detected in the middle of the night. I can picture my roomate coming home late, and not being able to get his car in the garage. My excuse of creating backup would probably not go over very well That would definately cause some negative RMAF. (RM=Roomate)

I would more like to see an option to skip files that you do not want backed up. Like the DooMotion DB, ULtralog DB ect.

I searched on how to suppress the error pop-up generated by WinZip by adding a flag to the Rotating backup string. So far I cant figgure that out. If that could be done that would be a quick & easy sollution for most of our problems.

Currently running the Rotating backup is working well, and Winzip skips my DooMotion DB file, and just reports an error for for it after completing the backup.

Could MS's dll zip-utility be configured to not report errors with a pop-up, and possibly just log them?

[Bill Brower]

Hey John,
I use the MS backup twice a week and I do it with HS running. On XP and above it uses something called I think 'shadow copy' which allows backing up with files in use.

I also run a script to rotate my logs and make a nightly copy of my home.xml.

With that I haven't ever been burned by a drive dying.

[turner228]

Rupp

a Good idea!

You have probably thought of this already, but I would suggest

1) a resulting filename based on the date
2) the abilty to copy the resulting file to a another physical disc, or preferably a disc on another machine using a UNC
3) the ability to manage the number of backup copies retained on the final destination

HTH
Kevin

[JeffCharger]

Greg, I think this is a good idea as long as it matches or adds to the functionality contained in the rotating_backup script that many of us use. I have used it successfully for a couple of years now and haven't had it miss a beat.
I too, don't like the idea of having to shutdown HS to complete a backup for 2 reasons; first, I challenge my system to see how long I can keep HS running with a hiccup; and second, I use HS to load a number of other processes and programs and restarting it would cause me all kinds of grief.


I'm not familiar with the XP zip process and like the winzip application since it's so universal (maybe this will change in time).

Functionality I would like to retain or see:
1) ability to keep a selected # of backups (e.g. 7 days)
2) a second cycle of backups (say, once per month - which would keep 1 each month in addition to the 7 days)
3) identify files or folders to be excluded from the backup (would keep the zip file size down considerably)

Tx....

[Rupp]

Guys,
First off the ability to shut down HS will be an option not a requirement. It may not be needed at all. I'm trying to duplicate the error to see how this dll handles them but so far I can't duplicate it. I'm modeling it after rotating backups.txt so it should be the same.

I'm at a cross roads here. If I want the ability to shut down HS and start it back up it needs to be a stand alone executable. If not it would make an excellent plugin. As a plugin you would have a configuration screen and the ability to integrate it with an event to schedule the running of the backups as you desire.

As a stand alone app it would have a user interface that allows the selection of files and an execute button.

[hhnew]

My .02

Rupp,
Like you, I'm not a huge plug in fan so I would prefer to see it as a separate executable. Also, I think the option to shut down HS to do a back up would be a nice feature. Might be nice to shut it down and do a back up once a week, month, whatever.
Not being a coder I have no idea if this is even possible but it would be really great if it could somehow grab the registry key or whatever needs to be backed up for the W800 also...
HH

[Rupp]

Guys,
If I make it a separate executable then how would you envision it working? Maybe launching the exe without command line options simply brings up the form and allows you to adjust settings and run the program. In order for it to be controlled by HS it would need a command line interface as well. Hum ...

[YoYo]

I thought I'd throw this out as a possibility for some of you as well...

I use a product called TrueImage from Acronis that will do backups on the fly with programs and files open. I have this installed on my HA computer and get a good backup every day without shutting anything down. It uses "snapshot" technology and looks at partition changes, not just file changes. Restoring files is a snap because you connect to a selected backup set via an assigned drive letter and copy whatever files you need. It also has a bootable CD that allows a "bare metal restore"; no need to reinstall the OS.

I discovered this little gem in my "real" job, and have used it with success in a number of scenarios, so it's worth a look and pretty cheap for a workstation at $49.99.

One caveat, I haven't ever used it on a Win98 PC, so can't say much there, but it works very well on Win XP, 2K, 2003, etc.

http://www.acronis.com

[johnwpb]

HomeSeer Backups

Rupp, If it is a seperate external .exe, how are you going to execute it? Will it stay in memory all the time, say as a tray icon, and execute at a certain time? Or will you have to run it manually?

Having HS run the exe would probably be the best bet. I'm not sure what the flags are on the Web Updater, but for many of the plugins, they launch the installer, shut down HS and then reload HS when completed. This could be an answer to shutting down HS.

Right now the rotating backup script does everything that everyone has mentioned here in this thread.

• Automatic backups
• Keep for XX number of days and auto deletes the rest
• Names the backup file with the current date and time
• Ability to store on a seperate physical Hard Drive (local or networked)
• Update a HS device with device to tell if the last backup was successful or not (With the small script add-on that I posted a short time ago)

All of these abilities currently exist. To make your script/exe an improvement on what exists already, it would need to:

• Optionally shutdown and restart HS for backup's
• select subfolders/files not to backup
• if possible, Backing up on the fly, as Bill mentioned, using "'shadow copy" which allows backing up with files in use" (Aleviating the need to shut down HS in the first place). Neccessary in my opinion

If you decide to take on this project, please feel free to use the code in the script I uploaded to check if the backup was successful or not.


As far as:

Rupp: I'm trying to duplicate the error to see how this dll handles them but so far I can't duplicate it. I'm modeling it after rotating backups.txt so it should be the same.

The Rotating Backup script is not what has the problem. It is winzip itself . when Winzip comes across a file that is in use, it reports an error, but still continues with the rest of the files. The main culprits seem to be open databases, like the DooMotion DB. It is possible, that being the DLL is MS, it is "shadow" copying the file and not reporting an error. It this IS the case, than you have already solved the problem It would just be a matter of changing the winzip line in the Rotating Backup Script, to use MS dll instead.

[Jebus]

winzip

I believe John is right, It is winzip. I do a full hs backup weekly and manually with a batch file calling xcopy. I have never had an issue with files in use. All of the files get copied.

cd ..
copy c:\homeseer\html\clock1.gif c:\homeseer\html\backup.gif
xcopy /Y /S /D c:\homeseer\*.* c:\backup\homeseer
exit

Rupp,
Why not do the backup first, then winzip the backup. Although I don't compress my backups, I don't see any VB hurdle with that.....JG




Win2k on a 1gig P3 512 Ram

[Bill Brower]

xcopy /Y /S /D c:\homeseer\*.* c:\backup\homeseer

I always suggest seperate physical harddrives for backups.

[Rupp]

Guys,
I realize that it is WinZip reporting the erros. It actaully nice that it's winzip and not hs or it would hold up HS without the errors being dismissed.