Zwave & Zwave Plus Devices Together

[burkeden]

Kind of a Zwave question, but HS3 also involved ...

I am using the new Z-Net controller with HS3. I just installed an HSM200 which is my first ZWave Plus (ZW+) device. I have 65 regular Zwave devices.

How can I tell if it is operating as a ZW+ device (lower power, better range, etc.), or working as a ZW device in order to be backwards compatible with my other devices? I cannot find any reference to ZW+ in HS3 when looking at that properties of the HSM200.

I have some Aeotec Gen5 devices that I want to install as well, and am trying to figure out if is best to set them up as a new ZW+ only network or better to have both old and new devices in the same network.

Thanks for any info.

[sooty]

I'm running a mix of Gen5 and nodes based on the 4.5x ZDK here albeit not on a Z-Net but a USB Gen5 controller.

What I can establish from some testing here is that:
If the route between a Gen5 node to controller is all Gen5 or direct then the node will report (Z-Wave Node Info page) that it's communicating at 100K. If however the route involves one of my older nodes then it reports as communicating at 40K.

This appears to suggest dynamic adjustment of communication speed based on route and I don't see any problems with secure Gen5 nodes routing through non secure 4.5x nodes.

Not sure if the reported range increase of Gen5 is only relevant when communicating with another Gen5 device.

As for battery life, again I'm not sure how this is affected if communication with a non Gen5 node.

All I can say is that my 47 node network works perfectly well with a mix of both types. I don't have anything older than 4.5x here. Remember 5.0x came before 4.5x.

Paul..

[randy]

I think Sooty is correct. Your Z-Wave plus devices will use less battery and still have better range, regardless of the destination. The communication speed will be limited by the slowest member of the route if routing is required.

My Z-Net is the approximate physical center of my network, which extends 60-80 feet in some directions. Most devices will communicate directly, including earlier devices. Z-Wave plus will communicate directly from anywhere on my property. So I think the only feature you might lose would be communication speed if the device has to use routing to reach the controller.

All but a couple of my devices are ZDK 4.5X and I have been able to use NWI with them up to 50 feet from the controller.

[burkeden]

Thanks rprade & sooty - good info.

FWIW - I added a Gen5 device and now both it and my HSM200 show directly connected to my Z-net (in HS3 under Plugins - Zwave - Node Information), but still show 40kbps. This differs from what you are seeing sooty.

It would be good to see a definite description of how the ZW+ devices behave when working with ZW devices on the same network. It seems to me we will have regular ZW devices in service for 10+ years, so this is not a fleeting situation.

[LeoS]

It would be nice to get more details of zwave plus behaviour and zwave plus mixing with zwave devices.

I'm guessing that running at 100K has a lot to do with getting longer lifetime out of the battery operated zwave plus devices. (ie:
"race to idle")

100K may also work at a shorter distance than 40K mode. So even if all the nodes are zwave plus, if the nodes are too far, it may drop down to 40K? Will this downgrade all the other nodes between it and the controller though?

[cheeryfool]

I only have two ZW+ devices: Z-Net and HSM200. The HSM200 has a direct path to the Z-Net and still shows 40k

[sooty]

I only have two ZW+ devices: Z-Net and HSM200. The HSM200 has a direct path to the Z-Net and still shows 40k

Are you looking at the speed value on the info page or the value in brackets after last working route?

Paul..

[cheeryfool]

Are you looking at the speed value on the info page or the value in brackets after last working route?

Paul..

I think I have some corruption here.

On the Node Info page the HSM200 shows: Speed: 40Kbps and Last Working Route: Direct (40K)

I just noticed however that my Node 1, is still showing as my old Z-Troller on the Node Info page, even though that isn't on the network or even powered up and the correct Z-Net shows in Z-Wave Controller Management as the only interface. Odd.

If I recall correctly I saw 3 Z-Wave networks temporarily when I backed-up and restored from the Z-Troller to the Z-Net and I deleted the spurious ones and kept the Z-Net on the original Z-Troller Network. Perhaps the db still partly thinks the interface is a Z-Troller and is therefore limiting the speed to the max 40k supported by that

Any ideas anyone?

Cheers
James

[LeoS]

Is there an official guidance or concensus on best practice when mixing zwave and zwave plus?

Should they be deployed in a certain pattern?
A). Zwave plus nodes near the controller, zwave nodes as the fringe ones.
B). Zwave plus nodes as the fringe, zwave nodes closer to the controller.
C). Doesn't matter, just run z-health every night.

[U5tabil]

Then shouln't the UZB stick (node1) show as 100k speed? Cause mine only shows as 40k...