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    #16
    Originally posted by ufd108 View Post
    I hope you reconsider the Zigbee support. Moving to HS3 Pro will be a big investment compared to Vera, and I don't want to make that investment and then have to change again in a year or two because HS doesn't support new devices that come out only in Zigbee.
    Which Zigbee protocol (specifically) would you like us to support?
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      #17
      Initially I thought Zibgee as Something like Z-Wave, but more open with more maintream brands using it (Philips Hue for one), but after hearing that Hue's implementation is pretty much an island onto itself, i wonder about zigbee existing as a true interorable standard...

      A quick search for 'zigbee usb' showed a few zigbee 'usb stick' controllers (including one from Digi!) but i wonder what they can be used with?
      HW: HS3 w/ Win8.1 on ASRock C2550d4i. Digi AnywhereUSB, Hubport, Edgeport, UZB, Z-trollers, PLCBUS, SONOS, GC-100, iTach IP2SL, WF2IR, IP2IR, RFXtrx433, Harmony Hubs, Hue, Ademco Vista 128BP, NetAtmo, NetAtmo Welcome

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        #18
        Here I have a few Zigbee devices that I am testing with the Almond +

        Lamp module, Appliance module, PIR, water sensor, door sensor stuff. Well much of the same as Z-Wave stuff.
        - Pete

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          #19
          Originally posted by Pete View Post
          Here I have a few Zigbee devices that I am testing with the Almond +

          Lamp module, Appliance module, PIR, water sensor, door sensor stuff. Well much of the same as Z-Wave stuff.
          Do they only work with Almond brand, Pete?
          If not, how do you know which products can work with which controller?
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            #20
            Here only have the Securifi products that work with the Zigbee devices.

            I have 2 Almond + and one Almond 2015 devices that I have been playing with and have configured the cloud application with the three Securifi devices.

            One promise though not fulfilled was being able to isolate the use of the Almond + from the internet cloud which would be a nice thing.

            Securifi folks have too configured the Almond + to work with non Securifi Zigbee devices today.

            A conduit from Homeseer to the Almond + device would be a nice thing to have. A Homeseer 3 plugin to a Zigbee controller would be nicer.

            I am guessing too that the Leviton / HAI Zigbee controller would function with the Securifi Zigbee devices.

            It would be nice for Homeseer to create a new controller box; similiar to the Z-Net box that talked Z-Wave, Zigbee and wireless - a combo controller thing.

            I have mentioned this before here on the forum.

            Many CT users are using the Zigbee controller today for primarily thermostat control and wireless locks today.

            Most of the new internet connected automation hubs talk Z-Wave, Zigbee and whatever wireless automation stuff is out there.

            Here is a Zigbee appliance switch called the Securifi Peanut. It is tiny and has a Euro look to it compared to the Z-Wave appliance switches.
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            Last edited by Pete; August 18, 2015, 07:59 AM.
            - Pete

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              #21
              Originally posted by Pete View Post
              It would be nice for Homeseer to create a new controller box; similar to the Z-Net box that talked Z-Wave, Zigbee and wireless - a combo controller thing.
              I would think this would be a support nightmare where you tell the user that the hardware communicates Zigbee but only devices made by company X, company Y, etc. Especially if the hardware is available in a more popular protocol. Why would i purchase a lamp module in Zigbee if my home is standardized on Z-wave or Insteon? In my opinion if Zigbee doesn't standardize soon and get products to market it will not be a primary player in the home automation arena. Look at UPB it's slowly fading as there simply are not enough devices to satisfy the users.
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                #22
                Looks like google is sneaking another hub into the home. This one supports zigbee Ish. It sounds like a great product. Though I wonder what privacy will be like? http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/...mart-home-hub/
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                  #23
                  Originally posted by Pete View Post
                  Here only have the Securifi products that work with the Zigbee devices.

                  I have 2 Almond + and one Almond 2015 devices that I have been playing with and have configured the cloud application with the three Securifi devices.
                  Looks really nice, how are they priced compared to the zwave counterpart?

                  One thing nice about zigbee is that they work in 2.4ghz, so they dont need separate transceiver parts for different market. Now if they make the power plugs to have multivoltage too (100-240v) then i bet they can make it at a really interesting price points..

                  Securifi folks have too configured the Almond + to work with non Securifi Zigbee devices today.

                  I am guessing too that the Leviton / HAI Zigbee controller would function with the Securifi Zigbee devices.

                  Most of the new internet connected automation hubs talk Z-Wave, Zigbee and whatever wireless automation stuff is out there.

                  Here is a Zigbee appliance switch called the Securifi Peanut. It is tiny and has a Euro look to it compared to the Z-Wave appliance switches.
                  Good to hear those companies are banding together to create their island of interoperability. I wonder where Philips sit in all this.

                  Originally posted by jlrichar View Post
                  Looks like google is sneaking another hub into the home. This one supports zigbee Ish. It sounds like a great product. Though I wonder what privacy will be like? http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/...mart-home-hub/
                  I'm kind of blown away because their ad/intro video makes no mention whatosever of its additional features beyond a 'smart' wifi router. I mean, we know from the tech spec that it can be a smarthome controller and an amazon-echo like device too.
                  HW: HS3 w/ Win8.1 on ASRock C2550d4i. Digi AnywhereUSB, Hubport, Edgeport, UZB, Z-trollers, PLCBUS, SONOS, GC-100, iTach IP2SL, WF2IR, IP2IR, RFXtrx433, Harmony Hubs, Hue, Ademco Vista 128BP, NetAtmo, NetAtmo Welcome

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                    #24
                    Originally posted by Rupp View Post
                    ...Why would i purchase a lamp module in Zigbee if my home is standardized on Z-wave or Insteon? In my opinion if Zigbee doesn't standardize soon and get products to market it will not be a primary player in the home automation arena. Look at UPB it's slowly fading as there simply are not enough devices to satisfy the users.
                    Zigbee has many more products on the market than Z-wave does; it's just that most of them aren't for home automation, and that may be why you don't realize how big Zigbee really is.

                    The question is not why would you purchase a lamp module in Zigbee vs. Z-wave. The question should be why would you want to limit your home automation system to one proprietary technology, Z-wave, and not be able to use some other type of product that comes to the market that is only in Zigbee? Maybe you don't need a new lamp module, but what if a vendor created a new lamp module that was head and shoulders better than any on the market today, but it was only available in Zigbee?

                    If I am paying much more money for a system like Homeseer vs. a system like Wink or Smarthings then I want the flexibility to work with virtually every new device that comes along in home automation, provided it is not a closed system like Savant. I realize it might not be practical to support every new device that comes along, but it should be a goal. To simply say we're going to ignore a potentially huge slice of the market by not supporting what many in the industry expect will ultimately be the winner in HA (along with WiFi and Thread) is short-sighted in my opinion.

                    And just so you know that I know something about the subject, I am an electrical engineer in the semiconductor industry. I just came back from a week-long training conference on IoT (Internet of Things) given by some of the largest semiconductor companies in the world, and they consider the HA market to be Zigbee, Thread, and WiFi.

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                      #25
                      Originally posted by macromark View Post
                      Which Zigbee protocol (specifically) would you like us to support?
                      Hi Mark,

                      I am not a Zigbee expert, but I was talking based on classes I just took with major semiconductor manufacturers, and none of them considered Z-wave as ever commanding any serious market share. They felt Zigbee, Thread, and WiFi (for non-battery powered devices) would be the market in the future.

                      That said, I would guess the HA profile would be one to support. But to give an educated answer I would look at the devices that are out there in the market and see if there is a tendency to one profile over the others.

                      Also, while I have not written a Zigbee stack, I would expect (if the powers that be in the Zigbee specification world aren't complete idiots) that once you create one profile creating others would be easier. So if Homeseer brought out a Zigbee plug-in that supported whatever the most common profile is currently, which I would suspect is the HA profile, then others could be added later if devices came out supporting other profiles.

                      I am not suggesting that Homeseer support every Zigbee device out there today; I am just saying that if I invest in a system like Homeseer I would want it to support all the major wireless protocols out there, and Zigbee is definitely a major player. Just the fact that every new HA gateway that comes out these days supports Zigbee backs up my statements.

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                        #26
                        I would think this would be a support nightmare where you tell the user that the hardware communicates Zigbee but only devices made by company X, company Y, etc.
                        It hasn't been an issue for me playing with the Securifi Almond +. Relating to the Leviton / lighting it just looks like another light switch. (IE: my X10, Z-Wave and UPB light switches all look the same to the OmniPro panel.

                        Looks really nice, how are they priced compared to the zwave counterpart?
                        To be honest here never paid attention to the price of the devices. I just played with the devices and did take them apart to get granular views of the insides of them.

                        Securifi did patent the LCD screen functions and still today the Almond + the only combo touchscreen LCD, Wireless AP, Switch, Router, Firewall and Z-Wave/Zigbee controller known to exist.

                        It has been many years now that Leviton HAI has offered a Zigbee serial controller for the OmniPro stuff. Many users of the OPII panel are using Zigbee with other stuff.

                        Rammohan Malasani is the founder and CEO of Securifi. He is also the founder of Ubiquiti Networks. That is what attracted me to Securifi.
                        Last edited by Pete; August 21, 2015, 02:33 PM.
                        - Pete

                        Auto mator
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                        Homeseer Zee2 (Lite) - 3.0.0.548 (Linux) - Ubuntu 18.04/W7e - CherryTrail x5-Z8350 BeeLink 4Gb BT3 Pro
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                          #27
                          I know that the Lowes IRIS stuff uses a proprietary stack but there are rumors that they will change so something within the Zigbee HA stack.
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                            #28
                            Originally posted by ufd108 View Post
                            Zigbee has many more products on the market than Z-wave does; it's just that most of them aren't for home automation, and that may be why you don't realize how big Zigbee really is.
                            Actually, according to the Zigbee Alliance website (as of 10 seconds ago), there are 1,094 Zigbee certified products. The Z-Wave Alliance was touting 1,300+ products a few months ago... not sure how many more have been certified since then. FYI ***Update*** I just looked at the Z-Wave Alliance site again... and saw a controller that has the certification number of 1,408.

                            The question is not why would you purchase a lamp module in Zigbee vs. Z-wave. The question should be why would you want to limit your home automation system to one proprietary technology, Z-wave, and not be able to use some other type of product that comes to the market that is only in Zigbee? Maybe you don't need a new lamp module, but what if a vendor created a new lamp module that was head and shoulders better than any on the market today, but it was only available in Zigbee?
                            It's a good question. I'd say that if someone created a Zigbee lamp module that was head and shoulders above the rest, we definitely would want to support it. That's the problem right now... there's very little that exists in the Zigbee universe that doesn't already exist in the Z-Wave universe. There isn't yet that one really cool product that only exists in Zigbee that everyone's clamoring for.

                            If I am paying much more money for a system like Homeseer vs. a system like Wink or Smarthings then I want the flexibility to work with virtually every new device that comes along in home automation, provided it is not a closed system like Savant. I realize it might not be practical to support every new device that comes along, but it should be a goal. To simply say we're going to ignore a potentially huge slice of the market by not supporting what many in the industry expect will ultimately be the winner in HA (along with WiFi and Thread) is short-sighted in my opinion.
                            Agreed. We're not saying this.

                            And just so you know that I know something about the subject, I am an electrical engineer in the semiconductor industry. I just came back from a week-long training conference on IoT (Internet of Things) given by some of the largest semiconductor companies in the world, and they consider the HA market to be Zigbee, Thread, and WiFi.
                            Sigma (owner of Z-Wave) is also a very large semi-conductor company. I'm guessing they weren't at this event?

                            Originally posted by ufd108 View Post
                            Hi Mark,

                            I am not a Zigbee expert, but I was talking based on classes I just took with major semiconductor manufacturers, and none of them considered Z-wave as ever commanding any serious market share. They felt Zigbee, Thread, and WiFi (for non-battery powered devices) would be the market in the future.
                            We'll see.

                            That said, I would guess the HA profile would be one to support. But to give an educated answer I would look at the devices that are out there in the market and see if there is a tendency to one profile over the others.
                            probably so. I'm guessing that's what the other controller companies are doing.

                            Also, while I have not written a Zigbee stack, I would expect (if the powers that be in the Zigbee specification world aren't complete idiots) that once you create one profile creating others would be easier. So if Homeseer brought out a Zigbee plug-in that supported whatever the most common profile is currently, which I would suspect is the HA profile, then others could be added later if devices came out supporting other profiles.

                            I am not suggesting that Homeseer support every Zigbee device out there today; I am just saying that if I invest in a system like Homeseer I would want it to support all the major wireless protocols out there, and Zigbee is definitely a major player. Just the fact that every new HA gateway that comes out these days supports Zigbee backs up my statements.
                            Kind of... Revolv was released with a gazillion radios inside (7?), but they never turned on Zigbee. That was basically a Z-Wave box. Iris has Zigbee support for their own proprietary devices. Wink supports the GE connected bulbs (no surprise there)... but they're out of money and imploding. It's hard to draw any conclusions based on those implementations.

                            We'll be finishing up the Amazon Echo integration in a week or so and putting that out as a beta. After that, we be studying the scope of basic Zigbee HA support. I'll have more to say about it in about a month.
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                              #29

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                                #30
                                Originally posted by macromark View Post
                                Iris has Zigbee support for their own proprietary devices. Wink supports the GE connected bulbs (no surprise there)...


                                Those GE bulbs are great! Also they are nicely integrated with homeseer using a Hue hub and the JowiHue plugin. I wonder if most people are hoping that HS will support these less expensive but ubiquitous zigbee products? This seems to be the approach for some of the up and coming HA hubs.
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